National Education > General National Education Discussion
Do we need an ATAR?
hebete11:
I understand what you're saying, but why do they need to find out? Surely if they put the work in, and if they actually learnt the curriculum to the best of their ability, then they should be proud of that. They successfully completed Year 12. Lots of students try hard, but they don't always get the mark they want (especially at the upper end, which can sometimes come down to pure luck). I think it's the wrong message to let students who try hard feel disappointed over a number, and instead let them feel empowered that they actually learnt something because they wanted to learn it. Some students will still feel disappointed if they don't get into their uni course, but this is inevitable under any system, and would reach far fewer students if no one finds out their ATAR.
geminii:
--- Quote from: hebete11 on January 17, 2016, 08:45:10 pm ---I understand what you're saying, but why do they need to find out? Surely if they put the work in, and if they actually learnt the curriculum to the best of their ability, then they should be proud of that. They successfully completed Year 12. Lots of students try hard, but they don't always get the mark they want (especially at the upper end, which can sometimes come down to pure luck). I think it's the wrong message to let students who try hard feel disappointed over a number, and instead let them feel empowered that they actually learnt something because they wanted to learn it. Some students will still feel disappointed if they don't get into their uni course, but this is inevitable under any system, and would reach far fewer students if no one finds out their ATAR.
--- End quote ---
I don't know about you, but knowing that I would never find out my ATAR would give me no motivation to do well, as what motivates me most is my ATAR goal. If I were to never know the result of my efforts for the past 13+ years of my life, I would be devastated. And if you really don't want to know your score, you always have the option of, well, just not looking at your ATAR.
Alter:
Secrecy doesn't really aid with the process because you would never be able to appeal anything. Imagine if you ended up with a study score of 35 in a subject because your sac marks weren't entered correctly when you had earned a 50. Then you could massively lose out on aggregate points and not get into your dream course. By obscuring the process, you leave no grounds for appeal. However, in the current system, it is possible to fix it up when things go haywire.
Plus, it'd make the whole scholarship process and aims to get into courses completely confusing for existing vce students. If you're not worried about your ATAR, simply never look at it.
hebete11:
I can totally understand where you are coming from...but wouldn't it be better if our motivation came from a desire to learn, rather than the superficial and extrinsic motivation of a number? That is true, but in a society where schools are so bogged down in ATARs and Study Scores, my concern is not because I am indifferent to my ATAR, but because the idea of an ATAR over schools detracts from learning and just makes students stressed as they feel their worth is being assessed. And surely there would be a way to appeal your course if it is not your first preference.
geminii:
--- Quote from: hebete11 on January 17, 2016, 08:58:50 pm ---I can totally understand where you are coming from...but wouldn't it be better if our motivation came from a desire to learn, rather than the superficial and extrinsic motivation of a number?
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Unfortunately a lot of people these days would simply decide not to try if it meant that they never knew their grades. For many people it is the only thing motivating them to do well. Not much we can do to change this.
--- Quote from: hebete11 on January 17, 2016, 08:58:50 pm ---an ATAR over schools detracts from learning and just makes students stressed as they feel their worth is being assessed.
--- End quote ---
I think the passion and drive people have to get a good ATAR to get into their course is what drives them to learn in the first place. You take away the motivation, you take away the effort. It'd be horrible for many people to never know how they'd done in VCE. It's a milestone and an important part of a high schooler's life (arguably the most important, in regards to academics), and they deserve nothing less than having the ability to know their own score. Whether they decide to know or not is their choice, but they should at least have the option.
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