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VCE Stuff => VCE Languages Other Than English (LOTE) => VCE Subjects + Help => VCE Japanese SL => Topic started by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 01, 2010, 08:56:12 pm

Title: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 01, 2010, 08:56:12 pm
Hi Japanese Learners  :D

Here's a list of 10 tips that I hope will be useful in your endeavours in Japanese SL. Some of these tips and techniques may not work for you, everybody is different, but I hope you can gain something from them.

EDIT: Significant rewrite in progress

General Language (Non VCE) tips

1. Continuous, dedicated study

2. VCE textbooks are terrible

3. Vocab > Grammar

4. Study tools/Techniques

5. ...

VCE Specific Tips

6. Start your detailed study early. Your school may start detailed study preparation from the middle of the year, but I strongly recommend you give it an early start. This ensures you are more familiar with all the possible areas within your elected topic, and really enables you to speak on your topic with more authority. Structuring your Detailed Study properly in script form doesn’t have to be done in great detail before term though. Just getting a general feel for it is fine.

7.  Script your oral conversation, and practice it with native speakers. I realise that the examiner’s reports often talk about those who obviously have memorised responses. The people mentioned in the report are those who scripted random sentences, rather than a fully blown script on every possible topic. A detailed script covering all possible areas in detail is very, very helpful for obtaining high marks during the oral exam.

However during the year, in the interests of advancing your Japanese speaking skills which are essential to be able to utilise your script to the fullest, it is best to speak with Native speakers, whether these be your teacher, a tutor, or your friends etc. Although even without actually practicing speaking, you can naturally become more fluent just from being exposed to Japanese. Not being fluent usually stems from lack of vocabulary preventing you from saying what you want to say.

8. Know your essay structures well. This is a simple way to ensure that you don’t lose marks you shouldn’t during the exam. Losing marks on your essay to incorrect VCAA structure is such a waste.

9. Write practice essays on every form (except story, don’t do that), using varied topics. Although I believe reading is more effective for improving your Japanese, writing essays can help you with structure, and gives you a bank of ideas to draw from during the exam, as you’ll probably get a very similar topic. I don’t think it’s beneficial to do it under timed conditions until very, very close to the written exams. It’s better to give yourself all the time you want so that you can gather ideas, which is harder to come up with under timed conditions than structure. When you finish writing an essay ensure to upload it onto Lang-8 for free essay corrections.

10. Near the Written exams, do lots of practice exams. I only know of JLTAV, Leading Edge and VCAA past exams. The JLTAV exams are written very, very poorly so do not worry if you aren’t so well on them. VCAA exams are generally much simpler, and the questions always fit the passages perfectly.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 09:04:52 pm
this is great advice :D
as a past jap SL student mysel, i agree with EVERYTHING above
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 09:15:34 pm
in my opinion any student who wants to do well should aproach this subject not as just another "subject" where stuff needs to me memorised etc etc but as an interest or hobby  (it will end up being so much more fun and as a result your ss will be AWESOME)

sorry if this was already mentioned above but it NEEDS to be emphasised

btw, a lot of vce japanese teachers will actually discourage you from going beyond the vce curiculum (like my teacher :( ) but just ignore them and you will be fine as stated above :)
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 01, 2010, 09:19:26 pm
in my opinion any student who wants to do well should aproach this subject not as just another "subject" where stuff needs to me memorised etc etc but as an interest or hobby  (it will end up being so much more fun and as a result your ss will be AWESOME)

sorry if this was already mentioned above but it NEEDS to be emphasised

btw, a lot of vce japanese teachers will actually discourage you from going beyond the vce curiculum (like my teacher :( ) but just ignore them and you will be fine as stated above :)

yes I definitely agree with this. Japanese (until very close to the Oral and Written exams) shouldn't be treated as a traditional subject, otherwise you'll get bored. Unlike Maths, Physics and the like, you will benefit greatly by ignoring the syllabus, and studying whatever you find interesting (which will push you beyond the syllabus).
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 09:35:11 pm
just another small piece of advice, it may be a good idea to keep a notepad and pen by your side while you watch anime, drama or whatever and jot down any words/phrases that seem to be commonly said which you dont yet understand, check your dictionary afterwards, you can build up a very fluent, native sort of lexicon which could help you come oral and listning exam/SACs (but make sure you know if the word is slang or not before you actually use it in a VCE exam, slang = big no no in VCE)
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: xXNovaxX on January 01, 2010, 10:03:14 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 01, 2010, 10:13:00 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?

you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 10:14:27 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?

i havent tried that yet, but its definatly worth a try
then again ive found that japnese learnt as a second language is different to a child learning their native language
actually unit 1 english language looks at something like that (but ive forgoten lol :P )
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 10:16:22 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?


you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.

lol thats actually a tad depressing to hear considering ive been learning since yr7
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 01, 2010, 10:19:22 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?


you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.

lol thats actually a tad depressing to hear considering ive been learning since yr7


LOTE education in Australia is broken =P

Not quite as broken as English education in Japan though.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 01, 2010, 10:23:48 pm
At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?


you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.

lol thats actually a tad depressing to hear considering ive been learning since yr7


LOTE education in Australia is broken =P

Not quite as broken as English education in Japan though.

hahaha i was an exchange student back in year 10 but im sure my school just exploited me to help teach "conversation" english :P
but yeah the way they learn english just does not seem to work at all :-/
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: kyzoo on January 03, 2010, 02:48:50 am
Most of Sm's tips are applicable to any LOTE. +1 for versatility.

At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?

you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.

LOL that's the exact same for Chinese. It's especially words that you don't use in essays but use in everyday life such as "sweeping the floor," "digging a hole in the sandpit," "licking a lollipop," just to name a few.

At the risk of sounding stupid,

is it okay to read childrens books (yes the type with lots of illustrations and maybe 3-4 sentences per page?)

Because they are TARGETED to people with simialr abilities? Or is this dumbing yourself down too much?


you will find that children's books are actually beyond the VCE Syllabus and harder than VCE exams (mainly vocab wise). Yes that's how broken it is.

lol thats actually a tad depressing to hear considering ive been learning since yr7


LOTE education in Australia is broken =P

Not quite as broken as English education in Japan though.

hahaha i was an exchange student back in year 10 but im sure my school just exploited me to help teach "conversation" english :P
but yeah the way they learn english just does not seem to work at all :-/

They learn from reading textbooks?
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 03, 2010, 02:55:43 am
well yeah, its all textbook based stuff that doesnt seem to have ANY relevace in real life
in japan english is compolsory from about yr7 to yr12 and students spend hours on end doing grammar/vocab type drills that just teach it as a math/science subject rather than a language
after 6 years of learning not a lot of people seem to know how to use it
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: kyzoo on January 03, 2010, 03:05:26 am

9. Write practice essays on every form (except story, don’t do that)


One question - what's wrong with imaginative? I've been advised against doing it by like 5 people and I want to know why =/
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 03, 2010, 03:07:16 am
its hard, very very hard
unless your native japanese or something lol
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 03, 2010, 11:49:18 am
its hard, very very hard
unless your native japanese or something lol

this. Unless you're very, very good, and the topic is good, and the gods are with you, it's pretty suicidal. For Japanese at least, even the examiner's report basically discourage students from doing it. Something along the lines of "very few students chose this topic, and very few of those students could write a compelling story".

I like to think of LOTE essays as starting with full marks, and every stuff up you lose a mark. The story just increases the chances of doing this due to its difficulty, compared to a persuasive piece which can be pretty safe.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: Gloamglozer on January 03, 2010, 11:56:04 am
its hard, very very hard
unless your native japanese or something lol

this. Unless you're very, very good, and the topic is good, and the gods are with you, it's pretty suicidal. For Japanese at least, even the examiner's report basically discourage students from doing it. Something along the lines of "very few students chose this topic, and very few of those students could write a compelling story".

I like to think of LOTE essays as starting with full marks, and every stuff up you lose a mark. The story just increases the chances of doing this due to its difficulty, compared to a persuasive piece which can be pretty safe.

That's exactly the same with Chinese Second Language.  Stories tend to be the hardest topic to write because not only do you have to have creativity, but you also need to possess a very strong vocabulary and dictionaries aren't the best tool since you need to use words and idioms in the right context.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: *ryan777* on January 03, 2010, 04:19:41 pm
just remember that for most text types the structure and layout of the text as well as correct use of genkou-yoshi will earn as much marks as the vocab/grammar you use
this is how many "average" students can still do well in the exam
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on January 03, 2010, 04:54:08 pm
imo, Persuasive/evaluative is the best because you really don't have to think that much, the vocabulary isn't that challenging,  and it's fairly fast to plan and then write (I ended up doing that Gap Year evaluative topic on the exam).

The viability of the diary entry depends on the topic.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: ammuzusak on February 07, 2010, 08:14:58 pm
What sort of stuff do they ask you in your detailed study thing? Like, say *common* if you did anime or manga, can you sort of plan what you can say if you have a rough idea of what they'll ask? I'm most scared for the oral examination more than the other parts gahhh
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on February 07, 2010, 08:23:59 pm
What sort of stuff do they ask you in your detailed study thing? Like, say *common* if you did anime or manga, can you sort of plan what you can say if you have a rough idea of what they'll ask? I'm most scared for the oral examination more than the other parts gahhh

For the detailed study they'll ask you on what you mention in your one minute introduction, and they're *supposed* to stay within those limits. Therefore, it's very important that in your one minute introduction you state your areas of study very clearly. They'll write it down, and try not to ask anything outside that (unless your examiner is an ass). Because of this, it's very, very easy to script the Detailed Study. I basically memorized my whole thing before hand, and there were no unexpected questions.

coincidentally I have a Detailed Study guide scheduled to appear on my site tomorrow I think. (And another post Oral Examination post for next Monday) =]

Don't worry toooo much about the Oral Examination =] It seems scary, but the examiners are generally very nice, and if you prepare well, it's actually not that hard to score well. The Written Examination is where marks are lost en masse (particularly listening).

Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: menashiiii on March 16, 2010, 07:27:38 pm
konnichwa!!
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: Fyrefly on March 16, 2010, 08:58:54 pm

ようこそ!
日本語を勉強していますか。
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: Furbob on June 02, 2010, 07:40:16 pm
would getting a tutor for Japanese be necessary to get 40+ raw? :\
Can your own willpower drive you to get there (lets say you find the subject as a hobby more than a subject itself)
or is it the lack of having conversation practice/someone to go over grammar with you = drawback?
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: IntoTheNewWorld on June 02, 2010, 10:42:38 pm
would getting a tutor for Japanese be necessary to get 40+ raw? :\
Can your own willpower drive you to get there (lets say you find the subject as a hobby more than a subject itself)
or is it the lack of having conversation practice/someone to go over grammar with you = drawback?

It's defs not necessary to get 40+ raw, but I personally found having a tutor beneficial, mainly as a Japanese person to talk to because I didn't really know any Japanese people, and in my class the teacher spoke mainly English, which wasn't good. Most of my sessions with my tutor ended up just being talking about random stuff in Japanese, without any real structure. I tried other tutors, including VCAA examiners but I found that teachers that have been in the VCE Japanese system for too long tend to speak too much English to you (a habit formed in class I guess), and teach Japanese in a "VCE" way, which isn't really that beneficial. If you do get a tutor, I would recommend getting someone who's come from Japan recently, as it's more likely they will speak to you in all Japanese rather than English + some Japanese. Also, they will most likely be cheaper than a current VCE Japanese teacher at a school ^^;

You also have to remember that getting above 40 raw isn't really that tied to Japanese ability. You could be incredibly good at Japanese but still get below 40. Likewise you could be not that incredible and get much higher. I've met a Japanese person born in Australia, with very, very fluent Japanese yet she only got 38 raw, when she was clearly much better than me at Japanese. I've also heard of someone who's passed JLPT1 getting 43. I found that a lot of getting a high score in Japanese is sadly (or happily, for me =p), exam technique and preparation. A tutor couldn't help you too much with exam technique; it's mainly something you have to discover yourself from spamming VCAA/JLTAV/Leading Edge exams.
Title: Re: 10 tips for success in Japanese SL
Post by: sonnypls on June 08, 2010, 10:49:29 pm
would getting a tutor for Japanese be necessary to get 40+ raw? :\
Can your own willpower drive you to get there (lets say you find the subject as a hobby more than a subject itself)
or is it the lack of having conversation practice/someone to go over grammar with you = drawback?

It's defs not necessary to get 40+ raw, but I personally found having a tutor beneficial, mainly as a Japanese person to talk to because I didn't really know any Japanese people, and in my class the teacher spoke mainly English, which wasn't good. Most of my sessions with my tutor ended up just being talking about random stuff in Japanese, without any real structure. I tried other tutors, including VCAA examiners but I found that teachers that have been in the VCE Japanese system for too long tend to speak too much English to you (a habit formed in class I guess), and teach Japanese in a "VCE" way, which isn't really that beneficial. If you do get a tutor, I would recommend getting someone who's come from Japan recently, as it's more likely they will speak to you in all Japanese rather than English + some Japanese. Also, they will most likely be cheaper than a current VCE Japanese teacher at a school ^^;

You also have to remember that getting above 40 raw isn't really that tied to Japanese ability. You could be incredibly good at Japanese but still get below 40. Likewise you could be not that incredible and get much higher. I've met a Japanese person born in Australia, with very, very fluent Japanese yet she only got 38 raw, when she was clearly much better than me at Japanese. I've also heard of someone who's passed JLPT1 getting 43. I found that a lot of getting a high score in Japanese is sadly (or happily, for me =p), exam technique and preparation. A tutor couldn't help you too much with exam technique; it's mainly something you have to discover yourself from spamming VCAA/JLTAV/Leading Edge exams.

Just because you got 50raw.