ATAR Notes: Forum
VCE Stuff => Victorian Education Discussion => Topic started by: ingramjack48 on June 07, 2008, 04:10:21 pm
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ASAIN SET
English
Methods
Spec
Physics
Chem
Either a language or a random subject of there choice
Business Lovers Set
English
Methods
Economics
Accounting
Possibly Spec
Either Bus Man or Legal
Arts Set
Further
English
Studio Art
Art
Viss Com
Jock Set
PE
English
Further
Business
Possibly an Art
MATHS HATERS SET (English Lovers)
English
Literature
Psychology
A History
Possibly Media
Possibly Philiosophy or An Art
Maths Lovers (MATHS ONLY)Methods
Further
Spec
Methods
Physics / Another science maybe 2
English
UMEP MATHS
ARE THERE ANY MORE??????
<Moderator Action: enwiabe> Made the title a little less belligerent
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Im mostly a Business Lover lol
English
Accounting
Economics
Legal Studies
Business Management
Further Maths
Maths Methods (CAS)
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Asian set should have ESL, not English, no?
LOL at "jock set"
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i'm a stereotypical business lover lol.
Im mostly a Business Lover lol
English
Accounting
Economics
Legal Studies
Business Management
Further Maths
Maths Methods (CAS)
hey i just realised- i'm doing all the same subjects as you, except for eco. woah 7 subjects
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computer geek
English
IT; Applications
IT: Software Development
VET: Information Technology
Computer Art
Specialist Maths
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ninwa's set (aka the ppl-who-have-no-idea-what-they-want-to-do-after-school-and-are-keeping-all-their-options-open set)
business subject (busman)
maths subject (methods)
arts subject (music)
science subjects (chem, bio)
english subject (english)
language subject (german)
humanities subject (international studies)
:P
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i'm a stereotypical business lover lol.
Im mostly a Business Lover lol
English
Accounting
Economics
Legal Studies
Business Management
Further Maths
Maths Methods (CAS)
hey i just realised- i'm doing all the same subjects as you, except for eco. woah 7 subjects
LOL =) i just realisedd that too. but i did methods and legal last year so only 5 subs this year remember =)
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ninwa's set (aka the ppl-who-have-no-idea-what-they-want-to-do-after-school-and-are-keeping-all-their-options-open set)
business subject (busman)
maths subject (methods)
arts subject (music)
science subjects (chem, bio)
english subject (english)
language subject (german)
humanities subject (international studies)
:P
i'm a ninwa's set!
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Well I was a crossbreed between an Asian + Business Lover Set....
English Language
Maths Methods
Specialist Maths
Accounting
Business Management
Chinese SL
Physics
Until.......I dropped Physics. ;D
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u can't do the maths one, you can only do a maximum of 3 math subjects including UMEP
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i'm a ninwa's set!
yay high five :P
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Haha, I'm an Asian set. I'm doing:
English
Methods
Spec
Physics
Biology
Psychology
IT Software
I wanted to do Chem but couldn't fit it in, I should've done it instead of Biology, I have no idea why I chose it lol.
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i'm a ninwa's set!
yay high five :P
i guess i'll join the club lol. :smitten:
dont really fit in any other one :D
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Artsy humanities [more likely to be a girl]
Lit
Art
Theatre
Classics
Rennaisance
UMEP Art History
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u can't do the maths one, you can only do a maximum of 3 math subjects including UMEP
I thought you could do all three maths (over two years) and then the UMEP?
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Wooooot..I was officially a MATHS HATER. Not like that needed to be confirmed or anything though.. ;)
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somewhere between the asian and the maths lover - though ironically i'm not asian. and the only guy at my school who actually did the complete asian 5 wasn't asian either. breaking those stereotypes, oooooh...
in my defence, i did do some arty courses! (french and music performance.)
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i think i am the artistic asian computer jock
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Brendan's I Like numbers set
English
Further
Methods
Spesh
Accounting
Physics
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for some reason i'm asian/computer nerd (but in truth, i love maths):
English
Methods
Specialist
Physics
ITSD
VET IT
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for some reason i'm asian/computer nerd (but in truth, i love maths):
English
Methods
Specialist
Physics
ITSD
VET IT
It is beyond my comprehension why you didnt choose UMEP....
:P
*EDIT: oh wait, UMEP is only linear algebra now! xD that's why!
and MUEP is really just a joke, so :P *
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I'm sorta in the Business Lovers Set
English
Further
Accounting
Business Management
IT Applications
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Brendan's I Like numbers set
English
Further
Methods
Spesh
Accounting
Physics
really strange set for an arts guy
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i'm in a quantitative business set (except for bus. man.. more qualitative, but theres no other subject related to quant com):
Spec
Methods
Econ
Accounting
Bus. Man
English
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Methods, Spec, Further, bio, chem and the dreaded english.
semi-maths lover perhaps?
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for some reason i'm asian/computer nerd (but in truth, i love maths):
English
Methods
Specialist
Physics
ITSD
VET IT
It is beyond my comprehension why you didnt choose UMEP....
:P
*EDIT: oh wait, UMEP is only linear algebra now! xD that's why!
and MUEP is really just a joke, so :P *
my school has a policy such that you are not allowed to study university enhancement subjects unless you have completed a year 12 subject in the area of study. My school also does not offer Unit 3/4 Methods in year 11, so there was no opportunity for me.
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why are we all talking about math-lover or business-lover?
Meatlover:
Chicken
Ham
Salami
Bacon
Beef
Mozerella Cheese
BBQ sauce
.....
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...mao -.-"
I'm a random "I love anything!" lover:
English
Spec
Methods
Chem
Bio
Chinese SL
History Revs.
(nah that's like Asian + "maybe i should give humanities a shot")
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Maths/Science with a language thrown in for fun.
-English
-Spec
-Methods
-MUEP
-Chem
-Bio
-Jap
An 'Asian Set' almost
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Definately Ninwa's set:
Maths: Methods
Arts: Music
Science: Psychology, Biology
English: English
Language: French
However I know exactly what I'd like to do.
Only my school/VCE doesn't have the subjects that match :(
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I should be Super Asian because I also did Chinese on top of asian 5. :)
[note to people who don't know me: I'm not asian :P]
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science (sort of): psych
maths: further maths
humanities: history revolutions, international studies
english: english
arts: media
business: legal studies
now that i think about it i think i was fairly well rounded haha
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I should be Super Asian because I also did Chinese on top of asian 5. :)
[note to people who don't know me: I'm not asian :P]
Wow really? What country did you come from?
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I should be Super Asian because I also did Chinese on top of asian 5. :)
[note to people who don't know me: I'm not asian :P]
Wow really? What country did you come from?
Australia, lol
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Oh I misread English Language as English Second Language.
My bad
That would be even more incredible.
English being your second language, having another language being ur 1st and doing chinese SL and gettin like 99.85 or whatever! wow
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I suppose I should call myself an honourary Asian...
English,
Methods,
Spec,
Physics,
Chem
+
UMEP Maths,
IPM
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u can't do the maths one, you can only do a maximum of 3 math subjects including UMEP
I thought you could do all three maths (over two years) and then the UMEP?
really u can do anything u want, but only 3 will count to ur ENTER
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The Jewish Boy Whose Parents Wanted Him To Do Medicine:
English
Hebrew
Chemistry
Methods
Specialist Maths
UMEP Maths
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Pretty much the Asian Set:
English (ESL)
Physics
Chemistry
Methods
Specialist
UMEP Maths
and I had to do a compulsory non-science subject:
Accounting
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lol at laced javelin boy
science (sort of): psych
maths: further maths
humanities: history revolutions, international studies
english: english
arts: media
business: legal studies
now that i think about it i think i was fairly well rounded haha
you're another ninwa's set! :D
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doesn't chinese count as part of the asian 5?
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doesn't chinese count as part of the asian 5?
nope
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But that's more than 5 subjects :P
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Someone I knew did Eng
3 Maths [inc uni]
Physics
French
..........and went on to do Artsssssss :D
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I don't fit into a set, it seems.
English: English Language
Science: Psychology
Humanities: Legal Studies
Art: Music Performance
Music Styles
There was a time when I did Methods, which basically gave me something from every category. But then I did Philosophy instead. And then I changed to Music Styles for synergy.
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Your forgetting the pure science geek which is not me by the way i fit in the asian 5 set (+Religion and Soceiry + Japanese SL)
Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
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how bout the new weird mhs twist on asian 5? (since our physics department is HORRIBLE)
methods
spesh
eng
chem
accounting/bio usually
BUSINESS MANAGEMENT (yes; bm...simply because our school guns it - 13 50's last yr o_o)
quite a few people are starting to do this strangely enough...but seems to be mainly a mhs thing =P
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Why would a bad department stop people from doing the subject? o_O
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how bout the new weird mhs twist on asian 5? (since our physics department is HORRIBLE)
methods
spesh
eng
chem
accounting/bio usually
BUSINESS MANAGEMENT (yes; bm...simply because our school guns it - 13 50's last yr o_o)
quite a few people are starting to do this strangely enough...but seems to be mainly a mhs thing =P
doesn't mhs gun EVERYTHING
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Someone I knew did Eng
3 Maths [inc uni]
Physics
French
..........and went on to do Artsssssss :D
wow, that's almost the same as me... except i went on to do maths.
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Lol Asian set -.-
Though.. I'm eurasian :P
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Someone I knew did Eng
3 Maths [inc uni]
Physics
French
haha and he was also big on guitar, played in a band, which started playing in assembly and went on too win a national award
..........and went on to do Artsssssss :D
wow, that's almost the same as me... except i went on to do maths.
yeah, he was also big into guitar, lol, and played lots of Radiohead covers in assembly. the band went on to win a national award
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Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
Psychology is not science and biology is barely.
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Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
Psychology is not science and biology is barely.
Those are some wise words.
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Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
Psychology is not science and biology is barely.
Whaaat, how could you say that? They both use the scientific method to test hypotheses like chemistry and physics do. I hate how people consider them pseudosciences, they function as a science ought to.
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Whaaat, how could you say that? They both use the scientific method to test hypotheses like chemistry and physics do. I hate how people consider them pseudosciences, they function as a science ought to.
They can both be sciences, but they are certainly the 'weak' science subjects in VCE. If you take a look at the students enrolled in Psychology, you will find that most of them are not science minded people.
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Whaaat, how could you say that? They both use the scientific method to test hypotheses like chemistry and physics do. I hate how people consider them pseudosciences, they function as a science ought to.
They can both be sciences, but they are certainly the 'weak' science subjects in VCE. If you take a look at the students enrolled in Psychology, you will find that most of them are not science minded people.
yeah, psych and enviro science certainly aren't soft options at tertiary level, but they are for VCE
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or you could be like ninwa and name a set after yourself :P
^^
goooooooo ninwa's set
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Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
Psychology is not science and biology is barely.
Whaaat, how could you say that? They both use the scientific method to test hypotheses like chemistry and physics do. I hate how people consider them pseudosciences, they function as a science ought to.
but they do not have the rigorous falsification as Chemistry and Physics have. The entire study of psychology and biology [note the use of study instead of science] is based on models that shows how something work, not why they work. As a result, even though they practice scientific methods, the model cannot be falsified, rather, it adapts.
This means that when something dont work, the definition of particular biological or psychological processes are "updated" rather than reworked on. The underlying principle is not changed so much, but the appearance and the packaging of the final model is close to truth.
in physics and chemistry, a simple variance means an entire reworking of a theory, such a case is the change from Newtonian Physics to Relativity, and Bohr's model to Schrodinger's model of atomic structure. they dont explain how things happen, but rather why things behave so. When something goes wrong, the "why" bit is scrapped and a new theory is written that explains the new phenomenal, not necessarily based on what is previously true.
Biology and Psychology arent totally "falsifiable", they cannot be considered as a science, only studies that take scientific methods.
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Mao, what does your post mean :(
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paraphrased: MATHS RULES SUCKERS!!!
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paraphrased: MATHS RULES SUCKERS!!!
AYE
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quotes from my chem teacher:
"Biology isn't a real science"
"They added more chemistry to the biology course to make it seem like a science."
"Biology doesn't require a calculator, therefore it doesn't count"
"Biology is for women; real scientists do chemistry or physics"
"Biology classes get to go on excursions because they don't have any real work to do"
note: i do not endorse his ideas, i just think they're funny :P
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quotes from my chem teacher:
"Biology isn't a real science"
"They added more chemistry to the biology course to make it seem like a science."
"Biology doesn't require a calculator, therefore it doesn't count"
"Biology is for women; real scientists do chemistry or physics"
"Biology classes get to go on excursions because they don't have any real work to do"
note: i do not endorse his ideas, i just think they're funny :P
what a cracker of a teacher, how hilarious lol
love the excursion one haha
(but i don't agree with him either, they're just funny)
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I don't think there's need for any real fuss over categorising the different disciplines. It doesn't matter if something is a humanities subject or a science subject or whatever, what's important is that they all contribute to human knowledge.
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quotes from my chem teacher:
"Biology isn't a real science"
"They added more chemistry to the biology course to make it seem like a science."
"Biology doesn't require a calculator, therefore it doesn't count"
"Biology is for women; real scientists do chemistry or physics"
"Biology classes get to go on excursions because they don't have any real work to do"
note: i do not endorse his ideas, i just think they're funny :P
Chem teacher at my school said very similar things about Psych
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I wonder if anyone's ever done Accounting, Environmental Science, Biology, Physics, Chemistry and Psychology in the same year... rofl.
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someone from my school did 4: Psych, Chemistry, Biology and Classics
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I wonder if anyone's ever done Accounting, Environmental Science, Biology, Physics, Chemistry and Psychology in the same year... rofl.
Haha my boyfriend's twin basically did that combo apart from physics.
Enviornmental science, chem, accounting, biology, psych (and literature) were his subjects.
It wasn't a very nice 3-4 days for him. :P
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sorry but... pwned :P
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sorry but... pwned :P
Yeah but he ended up getting a 98.5 or something.
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Humanities set with maths thrown in:
English
Literature
National Politics
Renaissance
Revolutions
Maths Methods
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in physics and chemistry, a simple variance means an entire reworking of a theory, such a case is the change from Newtonian Physics to Relativity, and Bohr's model to Schrodinger's model of atomic structure. they dont explain how things happen, but rather why things behave so. When something goes wrong, the "why" bit is scrapped and a new theory is written that explains the new phenomenal, not necessarily based on what is previously true.
At a most fundamental level I don't think scientists can explain why, they can only explain what is, or what seems to be. :)
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the 'anything but maths' set perhaps?
or you could be like ninwa and name a set after yourself :P
Aha, okay. I hereby name it the Apple Set. :D
Four subjects from different areas (five if you count last year), plus one for synergy (music styles)
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I did a cross between the Asian set and the Maths Lovers set.
English
Methods
Specialist
Chem
Physics
Further
Religion and Society
The OP also forgot a 'noob asian' set
English
Methods
Chem
Bio
Further
The Jewish Boy Whose Parents Wanted Him To Do Medicine:
English
Hebrew
Chemistry
Methods
Specialist Maths
UMEP Maths
I thought they would have wanted you to do Finance or Investment banking :P
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So many people do UMEP Chemistry this year, weird!?! And like, hardly any do UMEP Maths or Physics.
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Who's doing UMEP Chem from this thread? All the people I know of are doing UMEP/MUEP Maths.
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So many people do UMEP Chemistry this year, weird!?! And like, hardly any do UMEP Maths or Physics.
UMEP maths is all linear algebra these days :P
*Yawns*
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the 'anything but maths' set perhaps?
or you could be like ninwa and name a set after yourself :P
Aha, okay. I hereby name it the Apple Set. :D
Four subjects from different areas (five if you count last year), plus one for synergy (music styles)
nooooo!!! that's a ninwa's set!!! A NINWA'S SET :smitten:
:crazy2:
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the 'anything but maths' set perhaps?
or you could be like ninwa and name a set after yourself :P
Aha, okay. I hereby name it the Apple Set. :D
Four subjects from different areas (five if you count last year), plus one for synergy (music styles)
nooooo!!! that's a ninwa's set!!! A NINWA'S SET :smitten:
:crazy2:
Wait, is it? *checks*
Nah, not close enough. I want my own set! :P (If you look at specific subjects rather than faculties, we really only have one in common :D)
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I'm doing:
ESL
Chemistry
Biology (07)
Methods
Further
Economics
How would that be classified? xD I never know how to explain it...lol.
Oh, and I know someone in my school who is doing UMEP Chemistry.
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Also, fob asian 5:
ESL
Chinese SL Advanced
Methods
Chem
Spesh
Physics
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MATHS HATERS SET (English Lovers)
English
Literature
Psychology
A History
Possibly Media
Possibly Philiosophy or An Art
English
Literature
Psychology
Media
Further
(History and Lit CLASHED :( otherwise it would be the above minus Further plus Revs.)
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Science Set:
Biology
Chemistry
Physics
English
Methods
Psychology
Psychology is not science and biology is barely.
Whaaat, how could you say that? They both use the scientific method to test hypotheses like chemistry and physics do. I hate how people consider them pseudosciences, they function as a science ought to.
but they do not have the rigorous falsification as Chemistry and Physics have. The entire study of psychology and biology [note the use of study instead of science] is based on models that shows how something work, not why they work. As a result, even though they practice scientific methods, the model cannot be falsified, rather, it adapts.
This means that when something dont work, the definition of particular biological or psychological processes are "updated" rather than reworked on. The underlying principle is not changed so much, but the appearance and the packaging of the final model is close to truth.
in physics and chemistry, a simple variance means an entire reworking of a theory, such a case is the change from Newtonian Physics to Relativity, and Bohr's model to Schrodinger's model of atomic structure. they dont explain how things happen, but rather why things behave so. When something goes wrong, the "why" bit is scrapped and a new theory is written that explains the new phenomenal, not necessarily based on what is previously true.
Biology and Psychology arent totally "falsifiable", they cannot be considered as a science, only studies that take scientific methods.
Ok, is there someone who DOESNT want to be a bitch and can actually explain?
I hate how this forum is just full of people laughing at each other.
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MATHS HATERS SET (English Lovers)
English
Literature
Psychology
A History
Possibly Media
Possibly Philiosophy or An Art
English
Literature
Psychology
Media
Further
(History and Lit CLASHED :( otherwise it would be the above minus Further plus Revs.)
NO!! STOP!!! YOU'RE HURTING ME!!!
You could have done Revs.......and you chose Further ::)
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Wait, is it? *checks*
Nah, not close enough. I want my own set! :P (If you look at specific subjects rather than faculties, we really only have one in common :D)
:(
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Ok, is there someone who DOESNT want to be a bitch and can actually explain?
I hate how this forum is just full of people laughing at each other.
I don't really understand what Mao was saying there either but I THINK it's something like this ...
Biol and psych explain WHAT happens .... whereas chem and physics explain WHY something happens ... which makes it a real science, somehow?
MAO PLEASE EXPLAIN
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Ok, is there someone who DOESNT want to be a bitch and can actually explain?
I hate how this forum is just full of people laughing at each other.
I don't really understand what Mao was saying there either but I THINK it's something like this ...
Biol and psych explain WHAT happens .... whereas chem and physics explain WHY something happens ... which makes it a real science, somehow?
MAO PLEASE EXPLAIN
no, chem and physics can be proven wrong. bio and psych just adapts their theory =]
take example the ultraviolet disaster in physics. the classical model didnt match, and a whole new theory was wrote: quantum mechanics.
on the other hand [i have no examples], when experimental data are against biological and psychological theories, the theories adapts to include this new case based on the same premises, whereas physics and chemistry would have to alter their fundamental premises for a new theory.
that's the difference =]
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I still don't get how that makes biol and psych un-sciences :(
lol un-sciences. wtf am i on
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You didnt explain
what is falsify able
what is scientific method
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Lamarck's Theory of Evolution was superseded by Darwin's Theory. There's an example of data against a theory and the adaption of a theory.
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LAMARCK HARHAR dude with giraffe theory lol.
That's all I remember about him
/pointless post
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argh biology ><
as much as I disliked biology, I don't understand why some chem and physics people put it down so much ... it's not like it's any easier or any less important. I found chem a lot easier than biol!
And the animal and plant kingdom, or the human mind, can only be explained to a certain extent by chem and physics alone ;)
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I know nina, I don't get it
Some people think subjects live on a hierarchy like this:
Maths
Physics
Chem
Biol
Psych
Inferior, non science subjects
but if you made me do biol or 'lower' I'd be utterly lost
I think that is completely stupid :p
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okay, i havent laid it out properly:
a science is only a science if it satisfies:
scientific method:
theories are based on empirical evidence and observations
falsifiability:
the theory can be completely disproven by one disparency [as it relies on a key premise fundamental to the theory]
non-adaptivity:
if some case is shown against a theorem, the theorem is destroyed [falsified] rather than changed to suit the new situation
though Lamarck's Theory of Evolution and Darwinian Evolution [OMG i'm using the right word for once] satisfy what I've said about non-adaptation, however it does not satisfy the falsifiability [explain how one might go about disproving evolution emprically]
a good example that makes current study of physics a science is the revolution from newtonian classics to Eistein relativity
basically Eistein showed that Newton's absolute space-time was wrong, and the entire theory was scrapped and relativity [based on a whole new principle] took place.
relativity is currently continuously confirmed by empirical data [scientific method], it is not adaptive, and can be falsified [if light is shown to not be the absolute maximum speed]
hence -> "proper" science
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Whats emprical evidence
whats discrepancy
whats premise
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im doing
ESL
Accounting
Specialist maths
Methods
Physics
Software Development
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empirical evidence: observations from real life
disparency: difference/variation/disagreement
premise: underlying principle, [assumptions]
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1. I dont get how your biol example fails it, given your definition of empirical evidence
2. Why does that have to happen to be science
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1. I dont get how your biol example fails it, given your definition of empirical evidence
2. Why does that have to happen to be science
the three underlying principles are defined by Karl Popper, a realist in the philosophy of science.
a starter is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper#Philosophy_of_Science
biology does not satisfy the "falsifiable" claim [it is not a science unless it can be completely disproven] if biological theorems can be completely disproven with observations, then it can be validated as a science.
i would write more except physics exam tomorrow, :P
[ps this is extremely off topic, and should be split (or merged with http://vcenotes.com/forum/index.php/topic,2516.0.html)]
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how do you know all this :(
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No Mao, Biology is a science
Plenty of biological theories have been destoyed and it is arbitrary to say that small change does not change the premise of the thoery itself
Observe below:
Classical Cell Theory
All organisms are made up of one or more cells .
Cells are the fundamental and structural unit of life.
All cells come from pre-existing cells.
Modern cell theory
The generally accepted parts of modern cell theory include:
The cell is the fundamental unit of structure and function in living things.
All cells come from pre-existing cells by division.
Energy flow (metabolism and biochemistry) occurs within cells.
Cells contain hereditary information (DNA) which is passed from cell to cell during cell division
All cells are basically the same in chemical composition.
All known living things are made up of cells.
Some organisms are unicellular, made up of only one cell.
Others are multicellular, composed of countless number of cells.
The activity of an organism depends on the total activity of independent cells
Although the initial theory is not destroyed, it has adapted beyond the original contraints, introducing modern areas of biology including Genetics and Homeostatsis. The last and second and third points especially change the very nature of cell theory, incoporating reasons for failure of cells to act properly and displaying our deeper understanding of this area.
This theory can be disproven
If we encounter life forms that are not cell based. Eg purely energy based
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BA22: i would karma you again if i could :D
yes, that fits the Popper philosophy, and I grant that this particular aspect of biology is scientific. but you must agree with me there are areas that are not so scientific, such as [the study of societal structure in animals, i forgot the name :P ] (1)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Kuhn#The_Structure_of_Scientific_Revolutions suggests a different set of rules, however, is against the Popper philosophy and completely validates Biology as a science with or without falsifiability/adaptation
this is the reason why philosophy exist: no one ever agrees with each other :P
but because of (1), I do not recognise biology as a science [that and, no one has given me a good enough argument that convinces me]
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Fair enough, but i would argue that physics and chemistry have such dark theroms lurking somewhere, that i could find if i could be arsed
But i really can't
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the boundaries between the sciences are kind of blurred anyhow. theres plenty of chem in biology which is well...just chem but in living things. but then theres the whole social science-like side of it in evolution particularly which is merely theories and could be alluded to being almost philosophy
and a big word of warning to those who are bagging biology here but have never done it and think its an easy science; its not. many people actually realise that its more than just memory work and takes alot of problem solving and analysis unlike many of the other pure sciences which have strict formulas and theories which can be quoted word for word. the exam results speak for itself; u could lose almost 20 marks on the end year exam last yr and still get an A+. thats over twice as many marks as u can lose in spesh for an A+ =P (and dont bother trying to argue against that with statistical moderation etc. i really dont care, nor am i implying its harder than spesh, because im not. its an example.)
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the boundaries between the sciences are kind of blurred anyhow. theres plenty of chem in biology which is well...just chem but in living things. but then theres the whole social science-like side of it in evolution particularly which is merely theories and could be alluded to being almost philosophy
and a big word of warning to those who are bagging biology here but have never done it and think its an easy science; its not. many people actually realise that its more than just memory work and takes alot of problem solving and analysis unlike many of the other pure sciences which have strict formulas and theories which can be quoted word for word. the exam results speak for itself; u could lose almost 20 marks on the end year exam last yr and still get an A+. thats over twice as many marks as u can lose in spesh for an A+ =P (and dont bother trying to argue against that with statistical moderation etc. i really dont care, nor am i implying its harder than spesh, because im not. its an example.)
i dont do biology, but i do not consider it as easy.
just because something is easy doesnt make it a non-science. it is not judged by difficulty, but rather by principles.
and the examples you gave concern themselves with competition rather than actual difficulty. [A+ cut off relates to how many people do well rather than how hard a subject is]
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Perhaps it is because people do not highly regard biology and that is why they would rather spend more time on more respected sciences such as maths and physics. Many people go into it thinking it will be a 'bludge' subject, admittely, as I did. I have so much to learn for the biology mid-year exam... pages and pages and pages, far more than for maths, or even physics. Perhaps it is because of biology's uncertain reputation that the spread of marks isn't as tight as it would be for other sciences.
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nononon, big misunderstanding.
biology/psychology are considered quasi sciences not because they are "easy", but because of their principles.
their difficulty has absolutely no references to why they are a science at all, and that's why at no point have I made the claim "they're not sciences because they're easy"
given that, many people conforms to the herd mentality of either siding with or against this argument with little understanding :P
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Some people think subjects live on a hierarchy like this:
Maths
Physics
Chem
Biol
Psych
Inferior, non science subjects
This.
Sorry to change the subject here, but it's so true, and so frustrating. Why must I get looked down upon because people at school put too much emphasis on the "superior" subjects :S
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I still dont get why you know so much. Even how mao and glock both knew that river thing. where do you get it from :(
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It's philosophy.
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It's philosophy.
how did they learn it :( how do you know what to learn. where to start from. etc.
Edit: I'm pretty sure I've asked this before...
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When you're learning by yourself you have more freedom as to what to learn. I'm aware that you like structure but just jump straight into what interests you. A good start could be reading about philosophy on the wikipedia page and clicking on links which interest you. Then you could try other sites, then ebooks/real books etc. :)
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1. I dont get how your biol example fails it, given your definition of empirical evidence
2. Why does that have to happen to be science
the three underlying principles are defined by Karl Popper, a realist in the philosophy of science.
a starter is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper#Philosophy_of_Science
biology does not satisfy the "falsifiable" claim [it is not a science unless it can be completely disproven] if biological theorems can be completely disproven with observations, then it can be validated as a science.
i would write more except physics exam tomorrow, :P
[ps this is extremely off topic, and should be split (or merged with http://vcenotes.com/forum/index.php/topic,2516.0.html)]
Remember, its not necessarily one theory absolutely kills another... for example we still use Newton's Theory of Motion in macro applications.
Also, having done Psych and Philosophy, I might make another comment here:
You would be hard-pressed to argue that Biology is not a science or even merely a quasi-science. Most, of not all of its theories do abide with Popper's Falsification. I would say the same for Psych as well.
Seeing as you the one that has made the claim, what theories of either of the two studies do you consider not fitting that falsification mould.
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I know nina, I don't get it
Some people think subjects live on a hierarchy like this:
Maths
Physics
Chem
Biol
Psych
Inferior, non science subjects
but if you made me do biol or 'lower' I'd be utterly lost
I think that is completely stupid :p
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/purity.png)
http://xkcd.com/435/
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That's what she said.
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heh. i pinned wednesday's comic on my door. someone's already come along and written an extra note underneath it:
"physics is to maths as sex is to mathsturbation"
epic lolz.
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The reason I consider economics a science (for myself), is because it relies on a few very fundamental axioms (some standard ones, and some non-standard ones), and build up from there. The two important standard ones are: scarcity of resources and self-interested individuals.
It reminds me of how chemistry and physics both pursue the fundamental particles of the universe, and also how maths relies on axioms.
I'm not sure if I subscribe to any of the previously mentioned schools of thought on what determines what a science is.