ATAR Notes: Forum
VCE Stuff => Victorian Education Discussion => Topic started by: iNerd on January 21, 2011, 06:42:10 pm
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I've had a change of heart and decided Spesh is too hard for me ::)
I'm allowed to change subjects at the start of Term 1 or after Semester 1.
Should I change straight away into Further Units 1/2 (General Standard) or do Unit 1 GMA then switch to Unit 2 Further.
Unit 1 GMA looks partly Further anyway? Going off the 2010 syllabus:
1. Indices
2. Set notation/surds
3. Variation
4. Sequences and series
5. Quadratics
6. Ratios/similarities etc
7. Trig/3D problems
8. Circle theorems/properties etc
Any of that Further? Variation? Seq n series? :S
What should I do? Any advice appreciated! :)
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I'd do Spesh Unit 1 to start with, you don't need Further 1/2 at all so you may as well try Spesh out and see if you like it before you get rid of it.
As for the subjects, the only ones I know of are Sequences and Series and Variation, but I haven't done further so I'm not too sure
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I would do what luken suggests if you're still unsure. But if you are set on further, you might as well do the correct pathway to be as prepared as possible (as unnecessary as it is).
Just so you know...GMA is actually pretty hard (generally because you have to pick up so many new concepts very quickly) and not that I know anything about Further but a lot of what you take from GMA goes almost directly into the Specialist course which I don't think has very many similarities to the Further course.
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GMA is actually pretty hard
Exactly what I figured after surverying the book, syllabus, class projects and practice exams. I mean it's undue stress/pressure for Semester 2 anyway...but Unit 1 Further is a waste? 3 weeks on Linear shit -.- ...still thinking.
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I'm doing GMA as well this year....
Might as well give it a shot and see how u go, if u find that you are struggling with it you can drop it but no point not having a go
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I'm doing GMA as well this year....
Might as well give it a shot and see how u go, if u find that you are struggling with it you can drop it but no point not having a go
But is it worth spending energy learning non-Further concepts such as Trig in 3D, circle theorems and the lot because I have to pass to get 'diploma credits' (school shitty thing).
And I'm wondering if I should take the traditional route of Further 1 - 4 or do GMA 1, Further 2 - 4 :S
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GMA is actually pretty hard
Exactly what I figured after surverying the book, syllabus, class projects and practice exams. I mean it's undue stress/pressure for Semester 2 anyway...but Unit 1 Further is a waste? 3 weeks on Linear shit -.- ...still thinking.
Dude...I'll be honest, I was given a GMS test for fun once and I couldn't do it. Simply because I'd never learnt some stuff like a Simplex. I think there are lots of random things in there like that which you wouldn't actually learn unless you did it...linear programming and stuff. It's not hard to understand, but I just hadn't seen a question like that before and I was given no explanation. It's definitely not in methods and spesh.
Edit: just cos you mention "non-further concepts"...I will say that some of it is quite useful for methods.
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GMA is actually pretty hard
Exactly what I figured after surverying the book, syllabus, class projects and practice exams. I mean it's undue stress/pressure for Semester 2 anyway...but Unit 1 Further is a waste? 3 weeks on Linear shit -.- ...still thinking.
Dude...I'll be honest, I was given a GMS test for fun once and I couldn't do it. Simply because I'd never learnt some stuff like a Simplex. I think there are lots of random things in there like that which you wouldn't actually learn unless you did it...linear programming and stuff. It's not hard to understand, but I just hadn't seen a question like that before and I was given no explanation. It's definitely not in methods and spesh.
Edit: just cos you mention "non-further concepts"...I will say that some of it is quite useful for methods.
What on earth is a Simplex? -.-
And what are you suggesting now? Still stick with GMA for Methods help and review Further 1 in Semester holidays...? :S
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GMA was probably my hardest subject last year. =)
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What on earth is a Simplex? -.-
And what are you suggesting now? Still stick with GMA for Methods help and review Further 1 in Semester holidays...? :S
I think it has something to do with a shape or something made out of lines on a Cartesian graph, and the solution to a question lies on the perimeter of that shape (honestly I'm still not sure).
I'd say go with GMS because you're doing the 1/2 course for methods. I never did the 1/2 for methods which is maybe why I found GMA more useful for methods...but that's not to say it won't help you with the 1/2 as well. Just asses how you feel about methods and further. Personally, I would do GMS because I wouldn't want to go into year 12 completely unfamiliar with a subject. But then again, many will tell you that GMS is completely unnecessary. Your choice.
GMA was probably my hardest subject last year. =)
This. It's actually harder than methods 3/4 in many ways. But...GMA is awesome at the same time...especially at my school. ;)
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What on earth is a Simplex? -.-
And what are you suggesting now? Still stick with GMA for Methods help and review Further 1 in Semester holidays...? :S
I think it has something to do with a shape or something made out of lines on a Cartesian graph, and the solution to a question lies on the perimeter of that shape (honestly I'm still not sure).
I'd say go with GMS because you're doing the 1/2 course for methods. I never did the 1/2 for methods which is maybe why I found GMA more useful for methods...but that's not to say it won't help you with the 1/2 as well. Just asses how you feel about methods and further. Personally, I would do GMS because I wouldn't want to go into year 12 completely unfamiliar with a subject. But then again, many will tell you that GMS is completely unnecessary. Your choice.
GMA was probably my hardest subject last year. =)
This. It's actually harder than methods 3/4 in many ways.
Don't many many people go into Further 3/4 without 1/2 though? It's now a question of weighing up the benefits of practising indices/quadratics etc for Methods vs the time used for irrelevant material (3D trig etc) vs the 'traditional' route of Further 1 -4 ...
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What on earth is a Simplex? -.-
And what are you suggesting now? Still stick with GMA for Methods help and review Further 1 in Semester holidays...? :S
I think it has something to do with a shape or something made out of lines on a Cartesian graph, and the solution to a question lies on the perimeter of that shape (honestly I'm still not sure).
I'd say go with GMS because you're doing the 1/2 course for methods. I never did the 1/2 for methods which is maybe why I found GMA more useful for methods...but that's not to say it won't help you with the 1/2 as well. Just asses how you feel about methods and further. Personally, I would do GMS because I wouldn't want to go into year 12 completely unfamiliar with a subject. But then again, many will tell you that GMS is completely unnecessary. Your choice.
GMA was probably my hardest subject last year. =)
This. It's actually harder than methods 3/4 in many ways.
Don't many many people go into Further 3/4 without 1/2 though? It's now a question of weighing up the benefits of practising indices/quadratics etc for Methods vs the time used for irrelevant material (3D trig etc) vs the 'traditional' route of Further 1 -4 ...
I think only one or two people at our school did Further 3/4 in year 11 (not sure if they did 1/2 or not), while there was ~20 doing Methods 3/4 without 1/2.
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Are you naturally good at Maths?
I did GMA last year, because I thought that most other subjects, like further, wouldn't need the 1/2. So by doing GMA I thought I was keeping my options open.
In the end I absolutely hated GMA (I was okay Semester One, but by Semester Two I was a mess) and pretty much gave up on it.
If you don't actually like maths/don't think you will like the content in the syllabus, don't do it.
If you find GMA hard, chances are Specialist is going to be way harder and I would just drop it now. :P
Having a 1/2 you're really struggling with gets annoying - especially when you'd rather work on other subjects or your 3/4 subject.
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It's now a question of weighing up the benefits of practising indices/quadratics etc for Methods vs the time used for irrelevant material (3D trig etc) vs the 'traditional' route of Further 1 -4 ...
That's what I'm pondering. I can cope with Unit 1 GMA due to its Methods similarity and not many new concepts like vectors/complex numbers but will I miss stuff in Further 1...
Are you naturally good at Maths?
No.
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GMA is only enjoyable if you actually like maths. It is a pretty decent subject if you like the challenge...similarly to how people find Spesh rewarding if you put in the work. But if you find GMA too difficult and don't like maths then it'll be strenuous, time consuming and distressing, all of which can affect your study for other subjects.
It's now a question of weighing up the benefits of practising indices/quadratics etc for Methods vs the time used for irrelevant material (3D trig etc) vs the 'traditional' route of Further 1 -4 ...
That's what I'm pondering. I can cope with Unit 1 GMA due to its Methods similarity and not many new concepts like vectors/complex numbers but will I miss stuff in Further 1...
You're doing Methods 1/2. You'll be fine without GMA.
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GMA is only enjoyable if you actually like maths. It is a pretty decent subject if you like the challenge...similarly to how people find Spesh rewarding if you put in the work. But if you find GMA too difficult and don't like maths then it'll be strenuous, time consuming and distressing, all of which can affect your study for other subjects.
I don't hate nor like maths - I just do it.
I understand - I'm 100% dropping Specialist.
My question is now which course to take out of GMA1/Further 2 or Further 1/2?
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First option definitely, I think most of the top scorers in Further don't do 1/2 at all, so you may as well try something new/different, and Variation and S&S is both in Unit 1 so you can see a higher level of Further
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Why are you doing Further at all...I can understand doing methods for prereqs but shouldn't you pick another subject which you'll enjoy and find useful for yourself?
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Why are you doing Further at all...I can understand doing methods for prereqs but shouldn't you pick another subject which you'll enjoy and find useful for yourself?
It's out of Further/Spesh - you can PM if you want detailed reasons though.
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Why are you doing Further at all...I can understand doing methods for prereqs but shouldn't you pick another subject which you'll enjoy and find useful for yourself?
It's out of Further/Spesh - you can PM if you want detailed reasons though.
That's fine... I don't care enough to PM you, but if you're set on those two then I won't push another direction then. :)
Anyways...I agree with luken's reasoning! It seems like the most beneficial pathway.
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Excellent.
GMA1/Further 2 it is.
Thanks for the discussion - topic closed ;)
Discussion restarted below ;D
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keep GMA if you want to fully appreciate the name of the antagonist in Despicable Me
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I've had a change of heart and decided Spesh is too hard for me ::)
I'm allowed to change subjects at the start of Term 1 or after Semester 1.
Should I change straight away into Further Units 1/2 (General Standard) or do Unit 1 GMA then switch to Unit 2 Further.
Unit 1 GMA looks partly Further anyway? Going off the 2010 syllabus:
1. Indices
2. Set notation/surds
3. Variation
4. Sequences and series
5. Quadratics
6. Ratios/similarities etc
7. Trig/3D problems
8. Circle theorems/properties etc
Any of that Further? Variation? Seq n series? :S
What should I do? Any advice appreciated! :)
It really depends whether you think you can pull off a higher raw further score or a higher scaled spesh score.
If you decide to do further in year 12 then don't even bother doing GMA in year 11. Yes, further in year 12 is easy to pick up but trust me, covering a significant portion of the course in year 11 will save you time learning new things in year 12. It will be just a matter of relearning the old information. I myself switched from GMA in unit 1 to standard general maths in unit 2, and learning statistics in the second semester really saved me heaps of time in year 12 because it was just a matter of looking over the content and learning some extra things like time series.
And if you're from the school which I think you are from (from memory, judging from the PMs you sent me), then you will not be doing any sequences and series or trig in year 12 further because the faculty doesn't choose those modules. My recommendation (as someone who did GMA in unit 1 and then switched over to further in unit 2) is that you do further from the start, unless you are still having doubts about doing further in year 12 in which case it is entirely up to you. Best of luck :)
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Why are you doing Further at all...I can understand doing methods for prereqs but shouldn't you pick another subject which you'll enjoy and find useful for yourself?
It's out of Further/Spesh - you can PM if you want detailed reasons though.
That's fine... I don't care enough to PM you, but if you're set on those two then I won't push another direction then. :)
Anyways...I agree with luken's reasoning! It seems like the most beneficial pathway.
Haha thanks Pixon, hopefully I can get your Methods score :) What are you hoping for Spesh?
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That's what I want to do
At my school we have to do GMA 1/2 and methods 1/2 just to do methods 3/4! I wis I could just do methods
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First option definitely, I think most of the top scorers in Further don't do 1/2 at all, so you may as well try something new/different, and Variation and S&S is both in Unit 1 so you can see a higher level of Further
This is true, but looking at it from a holistic point of view, doing further 1/2 (especially unit 2 because of the topics they cover in that semester in the OP's school) will save a bit time in year 12 and you have the luxury of spending time on other subjects rather than learning new information for the first time (I don't remember ever doing statistics in previous years).
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That's fine... I don't care enough to PM you, but if you're set on those two then I won't push another direction then. :)
Anyways...I agree with luken's reasoning! It seems like the most beneficial pathway.
Haha thanks Pixon, hopefully I can get your Methods score :) What are you hoping for Spesh?
lol...it's too early to say. I generally hope for the best...but that doesn't mean I expect the best. ;)
With what streaker said...I'd say that's the most practical way to look at it and what it is what I suggested earlier because doing 1/2 methods should be sufficient without the extra help from GMA. But it seemed as though ATAR wanted a compromise between the two, and so I think he would benefit most in both methods and further by doing GMA sem 1 then GMS sem 2.
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That's fine... I don't care enough to PM you, but if you're set on those two then I won't push another direction then. :)
Anyways...I agree with luken's reasoning! It seems like the most beneficial pathway.
Haha thanks Pixon, hopefully I can get your Methods score :) What are you hoping for Spesh?
lol...it's too early to say. I generally hope for the best...but that doesn't mean I expect the best. ;)
With what streaker said...I'd say that's the most practical way to look at it and what it is what I suggested earlier because doing 1/2 methods should be sufficient without the extra help from GMA. But it seemed as though ATAR wanted a compromise between the two, and so I think he would benefit most in both methods and further by doing GMA sem 1 then GMS sem 2.
It would help if I got the contents of what exactly I'd miss from Unit 1 for 3/4 because if its a negligible amount, GMA will help Methods thus being the better course? (love how the topics restarted :P)
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That's fine... I don't care enough to PM you, but if you're set on those two then I won't push another direction then. :)
Anyways...I agree with luken's reasoning! It seems like the most beneficial pathway.
Haha thanks Pixon, hopefully I can get your Methods score :) What are you hoping for Spesh?
lol...it's too early to say. I generally hope for the best...but that doesn't mean I expect the best. ;)
With what streaker said...I'd say that's the most practical way to look at it and what it is what I suggested earlier because doing 1/2 methods should be sufficient without the extra help from GMA. But it seemed as though ATAR wanted a compromise between the two, and so I think he would benefit most in both methods and further by doing GMA sem 1 then GMS sem 2.
There is very little or no overlap between methods and GMA though...there's no need to freak out about being disadvantaged for methods purely because you didn't do GMA in unit 1 or 2. Personally I didn't find that the GMA unit 1 course complemented methods at an stage of my VCE. Of course I can only speak from a unit 1 point of view but I also heard that stuff like kinematics was covered in unit 2 - definitely not needed in methods. You're probably better off covering matrices and a bit of trig in GMS 1/2 tbh.
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I don't really agree with the statement that there is no overlap.
Trig, Circular Functions, Differentiation and Transformations are HUGE parts of Methods. There's also matrices as well as small things not taught in methods which are actually very beneficial. Things like the trig formulas, addition rules etc were extremely useful for solving questions like the pyramid question in Exam 2 last year. However I agree that you don't need to worry, because you'll cover them enough by doing the 1/2 and then 3/4 for methods.
I can't comment on what you would miss by not doing unit 1 further because I don't know what's in it. You would have to ask someone from your school.
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Trig, Circular Functions, Differentiation and Transformations are HUGE parts of Methods. There's also matrices as well as small things not taught in methods which are actually very beneficial. Things like the trig formulas, addition rules etc were extremely useful for solving questions like the pyramid question in Exam 2 last year.
See that depends on what school you go to, because I sure as hell didn't do any of that in the unit 1 GMA that I completed. I went to the same school as ATAR and, assuming they stick with the same course outlines, there won't be any significant overlap.
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Trig, Circular Functions, Differentiation and Transformations are HUGE parts of Methods. There's also matrices as well as small things not taught in methods which are actually very beneficial. Things like the trig formulas, addition rules etc were extremely useful for solving questions like the pyramid question in Exam 2 last year.
See that depends on what school you go to, because I sure as hell didn't do any of that in the unit 1 GMA that I completed. I went to the same school as ATAR and, assuming they stick with the same course outlines, there won't be any significant overlap.
+1. All that you listed (except trig) is Unit 2 GMA (and Matrices isn't taught at all).
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Trig, Circular Functions, Differentiation and Transformations are HUGE parts of Methods. There's also matrices as well as small things not taught in methods which are actually very beneficial. Things like the trig formulas, addition rules etc were extremely useful for solving questions like the pyramid question in Exam 2 last year.
See that depends on what school you go to, because I sure as hell didn't do any of that in the unit 1 GMA that I completed. I went to the same school as ATAR and, assuming they stick with the same course outlines, there won't be any significant overlap.
Okay well that's fair enough. We just used the Essential textbook for GMA and that's what we covered in unit 1 (minus the differentiation because we had learnt enough of that in methods 3/4). But anyways...Streaker is your best relation then since he comes from the same school.
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Once again, thank you everyone for your contributions.
It seems like I'm going to pursue Further Mathematics Units 1/2