ATAR Notes: Forum
Uni Stuff => Universities - Victoria => University of Melbourne => Topic started by: Ngage0 on March 01, 2012, 12:48:30 pm
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Does anyone find it depressing when you go to the Medical Building you feel like you will never have a chance to study in the building as its for the elite? lol!
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Does the Sunderland or Wright Theatres count?
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Does the Sunderland or Wright Theatres count?
YES! Every time i walk past the sunderland theatre i get depressed as hell especially when there is a lecture almost full of Med students and the professor actually teaching medicine. Makes me feel like i will never belong in the Medical Building. I don't have any classes in their. Share your experiences.
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Nope, not at all.
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Are you being legit or trolling?
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Are you being legit or trolling?
Legit! if your asking me.
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Being a doctor is not being a superhuman ffs. I'm guessing your parents are pretty strict with regards to you becoming a doctor and this is why it's daunting?
They're not even the most prestigious people on campus. We have Novel Prize winners and Olympians etc.
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So are you actually studying Med, Ngage, or?
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So are you actually studying Med, Ngage, or?
Think he's in Science or Biomed/
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Does the Sunderland or Wright Theatres count?
YES! Every time i walk past the sunderland theatre i get depressed as hell especially when there is a lecture almost full of Med students and the professor actually teaching medicine. Makes me feel like i will never belong in the Medical Building. I don't have any classes in their. Share your experiences.
But the Sunderland Theatre is usually used for undergrads, I think. Like MAST20005 Statistics had lectures in there... awks
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(http://www.undertheradarmag.com/uploads/review_images/ModeratBPC200_Basic.jpg)
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so sad...
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If i take Antomy, physiology and biochem next year, will i sit in that lecture hall? I want the feeling of studying in the med building like a med student. I don't think any first year subjects for any course including biomed are in the med building.
Being a doctor is not being a superhuman ffs. I'm guessing your parents are pretty strict with regards to you becoming a doctor and this is why it's daunting?
They're not even the most prestigious people on campus. We have Novel Prize winners and Olympians etc.
What do you mean there not the most prestigious people on campus. Those students studying medicine are studying Med in 15th ranked medical school in the world. Thats Prestigious as hell. Same can also be said about students studying Juris Doctor at Melbourne. They all got my full respect lol!
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I wish I didn't have lectures in the sunderland, it's always overflowing with people. Very very irritating, will probably have to sit in the aisles for half this semester. The only part of the med building that impresses me is the anatomy museum.
And don't feel depressed, you have a good chance of getting in if you just work hard :)
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What do you mean there not the most prestigious people on campus. Those students studying medicine are studying Med in 15th ranked medical school in the world. Thats Prestigious as hell. Same can also be said about students studying Juris Doctor at Melbourne. They all got my full respect lol!
Prestige is not everything. Nor do you need to worship it. If you're that concerned by prestige, be happy you're at the University of Melbourne!
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What do you mean there not the most prestigious people on campus. Those students studying medicine are studying Med in 15th ranked medical school in the world. Thats Prestigious as hell. Same can also be said about students studying Juris Doctor at Melbourne. They all got my full respect lol!
Prestige is not everything. Nor do you need to worship it. If you're that concerned by prestige, be happy you're at the University Melbourne!
yeah there are so many advantages to science that often people don't realise:
1. don't have to do a maths if we don't want to
2. Greater flexibility in science
3. biomed and science are practically the same in that it is not more 'beneficial' to study biomed because it's not like there's going to be a greater chance of getting into med through that undergraduate course
4. A LOT of people don't get into med from biomed, it's still freakin hard and some crack under the pressure of all this gpa, gamsat stuff and a lot of the time decide to go into majors that are also offered in the bsc
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The Sunderland and Wright theatres are the worst! They're the hardest lecture theatres to get past someone on the end of the row of seats. People always sit on the ends and then I can't get past! (I probably shouldn't be late all the time though...) Plus when you pull down the desk it basically pins you against the chair, there is no room!
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Those students studying medicine are studying Med in 15th ranked medical school in the world.
14th, thank you very much!
But seriouspost:
You can aspire to the medical course and it's good that you have a goal, but don't make it a question of "feeling like a medical student", as if your self worth is going to be determined by that. That's unhealthy. Studying in a theatre also used by medical students does not change anything other than the most superficial of elements, and if that will make a serious impact on how you view your prospects etc. then you should probably do some thinking about that.
Enjoy your undergrad, don't make it seem worthless and only of value if you achieve entry into a single course.
Also the sunderland is a horrible theatre, it's freezing and the desks pull down from the front.
nb, lecture theatre allocation is a random process. the only reason that all the MD lectures are in the Sunderland this year is because everybody complained last year when they had to walk between the Spot and the Sunderland every hour. I had anatomy in the Asia Centre etc. and completely irrelevant first year subjects in the Sunderland.
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Does anyone find it depressing when you go to the Medical Building you feel like you will never have a chance to study in the building as its for the elite? lol!
ngage if ur hot, blow the right people and you can join the ranks amongst the elite
but if its any consolation doctor's put their hands in people's arses
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Ngage0, if you take second year cultural studies subjects you will sit in the Wright Medical theatre...
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Anyone know were Anatomy, Biochemistry and physiology lectures are? Thanks guys this made feel a bit better i always thought sunderland and wright were med students only. Regardless i would still like to study at Melbourne's medical school. the building has some vibe to it i can out my finger on. The fact its so close to royal melb hospital is a plus. My dream would be to graduate from melb medical school and work as an Anesthesiologist and GP at Royal Melbourne Hospital. That would be amazing. I really want to have a good your of the med building, what else is held in there anyone know? Like tutes, pracs etc?
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Anatomy pracs are in the Med building
Biochemistry, Physiology and Anatomy lectures are usually in either Sunderland, Spot Basement, Law GM15 and maybe Old Arts and Copland sometimes
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Sweet, what are the pre reqs for anatomy, physiology and biochem. in first year?
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When I did it for Anatomy and Physiology you need both 1st year Biology subjects, and for Biochemistry you need both 1st year Chem subjects (it didn't rely much on first year chem knowledge though)
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i am doing biology of cells and organisms first semester and I'm also doing chemistry 1. what should i take up next semester so i am eligible for those subjects?
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Dude, fuken relax ye?
Being a medical student is no different to being any other student at Melbourne. Honestly, I want to get into grad med as much as anyone but lol, just go to the free bbqs, parties and talk to girls while you can. After university, most of us get married and have families and you never have the free time you have now. Don't waste it thinking about the future and the prestige of a bloody building lol. And if you really really want to get there, develop a close and intimate relationship with your textbook ;) Don't worry where your lecture theatre is ffs, if it's on the moon or in Harvard medical school, you're still a UoM Biomeddie.
As Einstein once said, "I never think of the future. It comes soon enough."
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Anyone know were Anatomy, Biochemistry and physiology lectures are? Thanks guys this made feel a bit better i always thought sunderland and wright were med students only. Regardless i would still like to study at Melbourne's medical school. the building has some vibe to it i can out my finger on. The fact its so close to royal melb hospital is a plus. My dream would be to graduate from melb medical school and work as an Anesthesiologist and GP at Royal Melbourne Hospital. That would be amazing. I really want to have a good your of the med building, what else is held in there anyone know? Like tutes, pracs etc?
You're going to get a double specialty then eh?
And plenty of stuff is held there, pracs for many disciplines (physiology, anatomy, pathology etc.). There's a museum on the second floor for specimens etc. Despite that, it's still only a building, you shouldn't get that worked up about it.
nb most of the MD students never study at the RMH
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nyone know were Anatomy, Biochemistry and physiology lectures are? Thanks guys this made feel a bit better i always thought sunderland and wright were med students only. Regardless i would still like to study at Melbourne's medical school. the building has some vibe to it i can out my finger on. The fact its so close to royal melb hospital is a plus. My dream would be to graduate from melb medical school and work as an Anesthesiologist and GP at Royal Melbourne Hospital. That would be amazing. I really want to have a good your of the med building, what else is held in there anyone know? Like tutes, pracs etc?
You're going to get a double specialty then eh?
And plenty of stuff is held there, pracs for many disciplines (physiology, anatomy, pathology etc.). There's a museum on the second floor for specimens etc. Despite that, it's still only a building, you shouldn't get that worked up about it.
nb most of the MD students never study at the RMH
really? What do MD or MBBS students genreally do after they graduate. Where do they find work? Do you have to work at District work Shortage for a few years after you graduate or something? Can you tell me what the rules are after you graduate if there are any? I don't want dual specality i just want major in Anesthesia and work as a GP and a Doctor who who supplies anestesia to patients about to take surgury.
Cheers!
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I meant study whilst a student, not work as a doctor.
And if you want to work as a GP you need to specialize in general practice. Same for anaethesia.
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I meant study whilst a student, not work as a doctor.
And if you want to work as a GP you need to specialize in general practice. Same for anaethesia.
Just to clear everything up, once you graduate from med school in australia you can work as a GP or Anestehesian any where you want?
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No, you need to be accepted by the appropriate specialist college.
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Go do some reading on the college websites, its usually a couple of years of work then several years of specialist training
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Okay, lets say i want to just become a GP after i get MD at Melbourne University. What is the process. How many years after MD do i need to go into the program and how much do i get paid while in the program? Is the program only clincal or is there theory and examinations?
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Work in a hospital for a year to finish qualifying as a doctor.
Eventually apply for (and be accepted into) a college training program when you've made a decision about your career.
Do the training (for a GP, it's 3 years) and pass the exams, assessments etc.
Get presciber number and work in your field
In terms of pay, first year out is 55k (roughly, i forget) and it goes up incrementally each year
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okay, so when can you be expected to be earning 100k+. Can you begin work as a GP in a hospital after you do your 1yr internship without further apply for the colleges? So what i am basically saying is. Once you graduate from medicine fully can you just begin working as a GP at a private practice run by someone or Hospital without doing the training and extra stuff. I was told once you clear MD or MBBS your a certified doctor and practically can begin work once you finish.
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No...why on earth would you be able to work as a specialist without training as one first?
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Not a specialist as a General Practitioner. You should have more than sufficient training to work because you completed the MD or MBBS. I think those special colleges are for Overseas Trained Doctors or people who want to go into the surgery field after medicine.
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Erm, general practice is a specialty. The colleges are for everybody - you can't bill medicare without being a fellow of a college. Graduating from a medical degree does not mean you have sufficient training to work independently (that's the whole point of the intern year)
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I know, so after internship year, you will sufficient training? I thought the colleges are for overseas trained doctors because thats what they say on their sites? Okay if what you say is the case were i have to take 3 years of training, do i get paid in the college programs? What are the requirements to enter these programs?
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The colleges are for everyone. You get paid while training. The requirements will be on their websites. It is generally highly competitive. Medicine is not an "easy" degree or career.
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okay, so when can you be expected to be earning 100k+. Can you begin work as a GP in a hospital after you do your 1yr internship without further apply for the colleges? So what i am basically saying is. Once you graduate from medicine fully can you just begin working as a GP at a private practice run by someone or Hospital without doing the training and extra stuff. I was told once you clear MD or MBBS your a certified doctor and practically can begin work once you finish.
No you need MBBS/MD, Internship + Fellowship to basically work in anything, unless you want to be a resident for the rest of your life :P
In all honesty, it's not hard to research, just go do some googling, start with the RACGP if you want to find out about them.
Anyway, why are you so interested in the $100k + pay? Money will come, medicine is not an easy career, money will come some time later on, don't worry about it. You're not going to be poor.
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Okay, so once you have fellowship from RACGP do you get payed in their programs. I don't want to be in more debt after i finish MD. I just want to know when your taking a program with RACGP will they pay you? And how much does a resident earn in australia? The #1 reason i am interested in money is because i want to pay of my HECS debt as soon as possible so later in life i can enjoy and have some freedom. I understand med is no easy feat and all that. I am not doing med for the money, however i cant live without money as well if you know what i am mean.
Cheers!
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Okay, so once you have fellowship from RACGP do you get payed in their programs. I don't want to be in more debt after i finish MD. I just want to know when your taking a program with RACGP will they pay you? And how much does a resident earn in australia? The #1 reason i am interested in money is because i want to pay of my HECS debt as soon as possible so later in life i can enjoy and have some freedom. I understand med is no easy feat and all that. I am not doing med for the money, however i cant live without money as well if you know what i am mean.
OK, I'll address your points individually
1) The RACGP will not pay you whilst undertaking their program, however, the government subsidises the cost of the program, so you will not have to pay to train as a GP. You will not have more debt.
2) Interns earn $21/hr, residents earn $24/hr, as far as I know
3) Well if you want to pay off your HECS debt as soon as possible, don't incur a debt? Get a part time job and pay your fees upfront, you get 10% off as well.
4) What do you mean by "so i can enjoy and have some freedom"? Do you mean that a HECS debt is restrictive? Do you actually know how HECS works?
5) "med is no easy feat and all that" - very casual, do you actually understand how difficult medicine is to get through and make a lot of money?
6) Why do you want to do medicine then?
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Yes you get paid, it's basically just you working in the hospital whilst simultaneously studying for the training program.
Your HECS debt is going to be the least of your worries and the government will be taking money from you from your first year out in order to pay it off, so by the time you reach 100k, it won't be that big a deal anymore.
You won't earn 100k as a resident/registrar (maybe not 100% true, but close enough)
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Those wondering about intern pay;
http://www.mscv.org.au/wp/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/ama-dit-intern-hmo-summary-guide.pdf
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Oh yeah that reminds me, interns are nowhere near $21/hr, they're above $30/hr
I found a document somewhere that was a rough guide, I'll see if i can find it in my bookmarks
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Based on the link I posted and this it looks like it's roughly $30.39 (page 61). Interested to see what your link says Russ.
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I am planning on doing medicine for a few reasons. 1. To help others (sounds cliched) lol 2.For the respect and prestige 3.My parents want me to 4. The money 5.To be part of doctors without borders
Just out of curiosity when does a doctor begin to earn 100k+ a year? How many years after they have graduated?
Also if you don't have specalist training and your a fresh medical graduate can you join doctors without borders for a year or 6months?
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I am planning on doing medicine for a few reasons. 1. To help others (sounds cliched) lol 2.For the respect and prestige 3.My parents want me to 4. The money 5.To be part of doctors without borders
You have got to be kidding.
(http://cache.ohinternet.com/images/thumb/7/73/JeanLucPicardFacepalm.jpg/618px-JeanLucPicardFacepalm.jpg)
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I am planning on doing medicine for a few reasons. 1. To help others (sounds cliched) lol 2.For the respect and prestige 3.My parents want me to 4. The money 5.To be part of doctors without borders
1) Stop asking about money
2) If you want to help others, go be an engineer and find out an efficient hydraulic method which can deliver clean water to people in remote areas in poorer nations, you'll be helping their health for generations to come, far more people than you could ever help as a doctor.
3) You will get much more respect and prestige in other areas as well. But I think respect and prestige comes from being good at something not from the occupation. Look at it this way. If you're a shit doctor, are you going to get a lot of respect and prestige? LOL! - it's not black and white you know
4) Why do your parents want you to do medicine?
5) That's a fair enough reason, but why do you want to be a part of the doctors without borders?
6) Btw, go to a medical school interview and list the reasons you've stated, I can guarantee you, you'll fail the interview. Tip: have a long and hard think about whether you truly want to do medicine and if so, why?
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1) Stop asking about money
1) the reason i mentioned money was, obviously you need money to live so it has to be reason for any job.
2) If you want to help others, go be an engineer and find out an efficient hydraulic method which can deliver clean water to people in remote areas in poorer nations, you'll be helping their health for generations to come, far more people than you could ever help as a doctor.
3) You will get much more respect and prestige in other areas as well. But I think respect and prestige comes from being good at something not from the occupation. Look at it this way. If you're a shit doctor, are you going to get a lot of respect and prestige? LOL! - it's not black and white you know
4) Why do your parents want you to do medicine?
5) That's a fair enough reason, but why do you want to be a part of the doctors without borders?
6) Btw, go to a medical school interview and list the reasons you've stated, I can guarantee you, you'll fail the interview. Tip: have a long and hard think about whether you truly want to do medicine and if so, why?
3)In my culuture being a doctor is considered the most respectful and prestigious job over others. But i know what you mean you can still earn respect and prestige in other fields depending on your work.
4)Parents want me to do medicine because they want me to be in a better position they are both my parents are engineers. My dad's an electrical engineer teaching at Melb uni. My mum's a software engineer working in ANZ internet fraud. So they think the best position for me to be is a doctor. lol.
5)Doctors without borders is preety awesome going to 3rd world countries and helping people in need who don't have access to the basic health care. Why else whould you go there lol?
6) I probably won't be using these reasons in an interview i know the second you mention money and medicine you have already failed lol. Probably gonna find some insperational stuff on net and use some other good points.
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3) What I says still stands though, you need to overcome that "prestige and respect" barrier, not the job, it's how you do the job
4) That's fair enough, but maybe ask them why they think the best position is for you to be a doctor - that will help you in your interview possibly
5) Well that sounds quite realistic, so keep that in the bag for the interview
6) I know :P but honestly though, don't "look for inspirational stuff on the net", have a think about why you want to do medicine? It's best not to lie in the interview, just think about the challenges you'll face in medicine, how you'll overcome them and other stuff like that as well.
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Hijacking this thread. 8) What are the options of a Bachelor of Biomed if you fail to get into med? I'm only doing biomed cos it was the highest atar and while being a doctor is interesting, I doubt I'll get into it. I've thought about engineering but I've only done Maths Methods and I'll probably have to start a new degree. Also for my part, I believe it doesn't matter why you wanna be a doctor (wealth, prestige etc). If you become one, you become one. You're qualified and therefore as good as any other doctor so your reasons for being one shouldn't matter. It's certainly not gonna make a difference to your patients.
Inb4 do your own research.
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Okay, fe thanks for the tips but i have loooong way to go before i even get considered for an interview for the MD course lol. I haven't even written my gamsat. Right now all i am doing is trying to maintain a high GPA. Haven't been assessed on anything yet but i am studying pretty hard since uni started. Just another 2 more years lol. Still its good to keep hopes up and know why you are doing med. What bothers me is one of my friends who got a higher atar than me 95.6 is going overseas to study MBBS and planning on returning as an overseas trained doctor in 4 and half years. He then plans on clearing the AMC exam and thinks he can begin working as a doctor from day 1. I told him his living in a fantasy if he thinks he can pull that off but then again i don't know. It whould be really unfair for others who have been have to study for 7 or so years if he pulled it of and started working as a doctor in just 4 and half years while if i got into MD i would still studying haha. whats your intake on this guys. Is it possible or is it going to fail? He checked with AMC to see if his university if recognised and everything. He even showed me to try and convince me you can but i am still unsure haha. He said all i need to do is clear the amc exam and clinical exam and i can begin work. He told me his written exam is just multiple choice seems like he might be able to clear that easily don't know about the other stuff he needs to do. He seems pretty confident he can do it. Have to wait and see.
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Well, I personally don't know him so I can't say as to whether he will fail or succeed in his AMC exam, but look at it this way, being Australian trained is something which is valued, when it comes down to it, a hospital probably might just give you the edge for a job because you were trained in Australia, might be possible, I don't know.
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Oh, what i meant is can you go over seas to study medicine come back to australia clear amc exams and begin working like any other normal doctor?
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With respect to MSF, you can work for (volunteer for) them as a medical student, you just won't be going and treating people in the third world
Clarity:
There's nothing wrong with wanting to know about money and income and mentioning it as a reason in an interview will definitely not cause you to instantly fail. It was the second thing I said when I was asked. Job security, remuneration and lifestyle are things that are going to define your life for the next 40 years and it's completely idealistic to expect people to ignore them, just to live up to some mythical ideal. I really don't like the trend of "if you're interested in money, you're a bad medical prospect".
The problem only arises when you don't have other motivations, because the effort/reward curve for medicine is pretty crappy compared to other potentially high paying careers.
What are the options of a Bachelor of Biomed if you fail to get into med?
90%+ remain at uni doing further study (honours, masters, professional entry degrees) and the rest work in the private sector (labwork, entry level positions) or something completely unrelated
Oh, what i meant is can you go over seas to study medicine come back to australia clear amc exams and begin working like any other normal doctor?
The short answer is yes. The long answer is yes, but he's not going to walk straight into the position he wants, in the location he wants, with the pay he wants. Hospitals prefer Australian graduates for various reasons, which is why you see a lot of international doctors having to work rurally etc.
He'll still need to apply for specialist training and so forth, which is where I can foresee problems
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fe, although hospitals might prefer Australians medical graduates. It seems like once he clears his AMC exam he is pretty much the same pool as every other australian medical graduate. As you said he will have to do specialist training which is also required for aussie med grads which is preety unfair if you ask me, the aussie grads have worked there ass off to get to where they are and you see people like this cutting in line to become doctors. He told me and showed me if you are an australian citizen who has an overseas medical qualification you are not required to work in rural areas as you are exempt from it. So he just needs to clear amc and get specialist training(just like any another australian grad).
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Not being required to work rurally and not working rurally are two very different things
Being an Australian citizen will help him, sure, but he still has to get a job at a hospital and deal with the fact that hospitals like hiring people who they've already been training for the last couple of years, rather than people they've never seen before
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Essentially what Russ said is right, in my own knowledge anyway.
The problem only arises when you don't have other motivations, because the effort/reward curve for medicine is pretty crappy compared to other potentially high paying careers.
That's exactly why if you're interested in money, other careers might be more suitable.
But anyways, Ngage0,
the aussie grads have worked theretheir ass off to get to where they are and you see people like this cutting in line to become doctors.
I've always considered doctors as people who can spell :P
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hahaha aw, come on i was typing fast and not thinking. What do you think paulsterio of australian OTD's taking short cuts?
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hahaha aw, come on i was typing fast and not thinking. What do you think paulsterio of australian OTD's taking short cuts?
I was being light hearted :P
Anyway, I think it's a two-sided issue, it's not fair to reject all OTDs because like there are some doctors who want to genuinely want to move to Australia. I think honestly it's not a massive issue. They're paying heaps of money to get their medical education overseas. The issues which come along with that pathway such as AMC, registration and employment issues...etc. will essentially be the downfalls to such a path.
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all good :) i agree, with your opinion both pathways have there ups and downs. OTD's may have a shorter path but employment and job hunting is going to be tough for them. Aussie grads have a good education and better employment opportunities but a longer path and also one that requires much more hard work.
Seems alright i guess.