ATAR Notes: Forum
VCE Stuff => Victorian Education Discussion => Topic started by: greenbeans on April 04, 2012, 02:38:00 pm
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Attention high school students, life WILL go on after VCE!
For most of us, that thing called ‘life’ is actually called ‘Uni’, and once you’ve dived into this epic battle of books and study and balancing a social life and sleep deprivation, yep, you think it’ll never end, but it does! Drawing on my own experience, you think that year 12 is the be all and end all, but once you’re passed VCE, now you can get on with your life. But the trouble is, and the point I want to generate here, is that perhaps we are all too focused on sticking to study designs and knowing ‘the system’ so well that we get a bit, well, *baffled* when we get into Uni.
And it’s not surprising really. Unless you’ve been living under a rock, there’s been a few media releases in the papers lately talking about how even some really, really high achievers in high school were struggling to make sense of how to study independently, how to use time effectively and, yes, how to even take notes in lectures! Which got me thinking that yes, I am feeling in the same boat as some of these kiddos, fresh out of dominating high school and then feeling a little lost.
It mightn’t be the case for many people, but those case studies cropping up in the papers resonated strongly with me. We’re taught in an environment where not just knowing your content but knowing HOW the whole VCE operates is really imperative in terms of achieving your highest possible ATAR. But after getting those 4 digits on that heavily awaited day in December that seemed, for however long, to “define” your intellect and you as a person and slot you into the right Uni course, it’s ironic that this system which helps you achieve your potential into GETTING into Uni then does you a disservice by NOT preparing you for what Uni is all about.
So this got me thinking, how can we help those currently completing VCE for the huge gear change in Uni? Well, the first piece of advice that comes to mind would be to learn how to be as resourceful as possible, starting now. For instance, learn how to properly research things, or start going one step further in finding additional materials, documentaries, movie interpretations of your novels, etc. Plenty of people get to Uni unsure how a library really operates, that was me included. Start making the most of the experts around you - your teachers and peers have plenty of knowledge and other interpretations on topics. Savour every drop of your last 2 years of school. Before you know it, it’ll be hard to make time for even some of your closest friends who go to different Unis when suffocating from a pile of assignments and juggling part-time work. You won’t know how lucky you were seeing them so often at school until that luxury is gone.
So, do you guys out there agree with me here? Or do you think that this is a problem only affecting a minority of post-VCE students? What would you, as a Uni student, advise current students to be doing? Would love to hear your thoughts about it, so long as no disrespect or harassment is intended.
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+1
Even if you end up doing something demanding like Law or Med, uni is still way more fun :D
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Attention high school students, life WILL go on after VCE!
Most definitely but even then i think you should enjoy highschool while it lasts, year 11 and 12 were probably the best years of my life so far and the overall feel of uni for me so far pales in comparison. I really will cherish those memories forever. Really, do study hard but do enjoy highschool as well, everyone will end up all over the place sooner or later.
For most of us, that thing called ‘life’ is actually called ‘Uni’, and once you’ve dived into this epic battle of books and study and balancing a social life and sleep deprivation, yep, you think it’ll never end, but it does! Drawing on my own experience, you think that year 12 is the be all and end all, but once you’re passed VCE, now you can get on with your life. But the trouble is, and the point I want to generate here, is that perhaps we are all too focused on sticking to study designs and knowing ‘the system’ so well that we get a bit, well, *baffled* when we get into Uni.
And it’s not surprising really. Unless you’ve been living under a rock, there’s been a few media releases in the papers lately talking about how even some really, really high achievers in high school were struggling to make sense of how to study independently, how to use time effectively and, yes, how to even take notes in lectures! Which got me thinking that yes, I am feeling in the same boat as some of these kiddos, fresh out of dominating high school and then feeling a little lost.
Haha, i think its half that but also half people tend to really get more lazier once they get into uni. For all those people already in uni, you know what i'm talking about.
I think its just the utter freedom you get in uni. If you dont do your work or never show up no one will scream at you and half the time they won't really even care enough to bring you up on it until it gets really bad.
The kind of people who do very well in the VCE are already people who do very well under structure or became people that do very well under structure. You then go to uni and it hits you with a massive dose of free reign.
In my first year (now in 2nd) i just literally had no idea what to do. I'd go to my lectures and go home but i felt like i should be working or doing something.... they didn't give us any actual homework to do though...
Thats the thing, thats where the freedom comes in. There's no real 'best way' in uni like their is in VCE. If you want to go home and do extra textbook questions, thats your choice. If you want to form a study group, thats your choice. Even if you just want to go off the lectures and never touch a textbook (very achievable for most subjects) thats your choice. Its all your choice and its all up to you, i think it just disorientates people.
That and in uni people tend to be way less hardcore than VCE. If you didn't have time to enjoy your life and actually live in VCE....will you have time in uni? If not now, then when?
Uni is so much bigger than just work as well. There are plenty of people who just show up for their classes and leave, they dont even form strong friendships, they just 'know' people or keep the old highschool ones going if they're lucky enough to have them. You're exposed to a totally new enviroment with people from all over the world and from all backgrounds. In highschool, a lot of the cohort had similar ethnic/socioeconomic/religious backgrounds depending on the type of school and where you lived, uni totally turns that upside down on its head. Uni really is the time to have fun and meet people (great place to pick up a partner as well, imagine how much more difficult that would be without uni/school). So, i think its actually a good sign they're not working as hard as they did in VCE.
but knowing HOW the whole VCE operates is really imperative in terms of achieving your highest possible ATAR.
Haha yeah thats next to impossible in uni, not that it matters, the marking tends to be a lot more easier to understand.
slot you into the right Uni course,
Not very sure about this, a lot of people are still unsure. Especially in generalist courses like Bsc or BA there is a serious lack of direction amongst a lot of people, even myself to some degree. I know plenty of people in my Bsc who intended to swap out or wanted to be a "scientist" after they graduated (little bit more specific obviously). I really think half the people in my course and indeed in a lot of courses are just there because they want something to do, they want to continue on the kind of highschool thing they had, they want to stay out of the real world for a bit longer. Kind of...procrastinating on life.. This obviously isn't true for all but it is true for many.
it’s ironic that this system which helps you achieve your potential into GETTING into Uni then does you a disservice by NOT preparing you for what Uni is all about.
I think its all about preparing yourself. You shouldn't need to be spoonfed anymore. It's sort of a baptism by fire, they throw you in the deep end but thats how you learn, thats how you grow.
It reminds me of an article i read about people suffering depression, it's an absolutely horrible thing to have of course and to go through but at the end of their own little personal hell, if they got through it, a lot of these people ended up stronger. They might of had thought patterns or ways of thinking or living that weren't as great, if they didn't go through all that pain, they wouldn't of bettered themselves. It's sort of like that, its a massive shock to the system at first but you really need to start being independent and taking responsibility for yourself, its what will make you successful in almost all facets of life.
For instance, learn how to properly research things, or start going one step further in finding additional materials, documentaries, movie interpretations of your novels, etc. Plenty of people get to Uni unsure how a library really operates, that was me included.
Haha, i think you're jumping the gun a bit here. I reckon that can wait untill uni. It may be useful for english but outside courses like that, barring personal interest, its not very useful for VCE unfortunately.
My advice would be just really focus on the actual process of learning, what works for you, what doesn't? What distracts you, what helps? Even general life skills like how to cope with stress. The big wide world out there won't always be a standardised test, these things are important.
Savour every drop of your last 2 years of school. Before you know it, it’ll be hard to make time for even some of your closest friends who go to different Unis when suffocating from a pile of assignments and juggling part-time work. You won’t know how lucky you were seeing them so often at school until that luxury is gone.
^^
Or do you think that this is a problem only affecting a minority of post-VCE students?
Sort of do and sort of don't. This forum is obviously full of the near elite of VCE, even by being here and participating you're pretty hardcore, to the point of a near obsession sometimes.
A lot of people are heavily invested in the whole system. We are but a tiny slice of the general VCE population though.
So, i think in regards to just being use to the systems and knowing all the ins and outs, thats a minority. I mean a lot of people here would know more than the VCE co-ordinators and thats what they're paid for..
However, Uni being a shock to the system, i think almost everyone goes through that. It's just like any struggle in life though, you grow and wind up better. It's good you're "on your own" not having some professionals holding your hand, that way you really grow. In second year now i've seen relatively few people crumble. There are obviously those who never did work to begin with but those who actually tried adapted pretty well.
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Year 12 has been the best year of my life so far. Unbelievable.
Uni is a struggle, and you are out in the real world now! It's all up to you. In year 12 the work is shoved down your throats and you are in this protected environment, that is, the school yard. There are no outside intrusions, and you are now put amongst reality. It's a big change.
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Quite to the contrary, I thought VCE was sucks. I much prefer uni, didn't care much about the VCE system. Could that account for my difference, therefore less of a shock for me compared to you guys?
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Quite to the contrary, I thought VCE was sucks. I much prefer uni, didn't care much about the VCE system. Could that account for my difference, therefore less of a shock for me compared to you guys?
Ditto x 1000. I hated VCE; it was probably the worst year of my life.
Not that it was completely devoid of awesome, unforgettable moments, but still...
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The VCE is a pretty disgusting system when you think about it.
Don't let it control your life. VCE means shit once you start uni.
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The VCE is a pretty disgusting system when you think about it.
Don't let it control your life. VCE means shit once you start uni.
Unless you want a scholorship ;)
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I was watching Insight earlier this week (highly recommended, it was a good episode on education) and a uni lecturer on the programme made the point that high achievers at high school knew how to play the system and focused on what was on the exam, to the exclusion of other things. As a lecturer, she got quite frustrated by students who were trying to learn to the exam and constantly asked what was going to be on the exam, because in the end by just studying for the exam you may do really well, but you're missing out on a lot of stuff and of part of the fun of education.
In my experience as well, in a lot of subjects at uni, there is a degree of creativity. It's good to approach a question or problem in a way that nobody else approached it. For students to actually be able to do that requires a fair bit of knowledge and a deep understanding.
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I actually prefer uni to yr 12.
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I was watching Insight earlier this week (highly recommended, it was a good episode on education)
Here's the link to anyone interested:
http://www.sbs.com.au/insight/episode/watchonline/463/Class-Struggle
I actually prefer uni to yr 12.
That makes two of us. Though please elaborate further on why.
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Content in uni is interesting, not always the case at school
You're bound to find a group of people with similar interests to you, lots of clubs/activities
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I was watching Insight earlier this week (highly recommended, it was a good episode on education)
Here's the link to anyone interested:
http://www.sbs.com.au/insight/episode/watchonline/463/Class-Struggle
I actually prefer uni to yr 12.
That makes two of us. Though please elaborate further on why.
* I like how our mid year holidays are essentially as good as the end of year holidays, since we start new uni subjects in semester 2 anyway.
* For my subjects at least they have a lot of topic tutorials and just normal tutorials running often and the staff are really helpful
* It kind of makes me more organised because they don't remind you anything, you have to always look at the lms, portal etc.
* There's a lot of food around the uni haha
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man uni>>>>>>>>>>>>>>yr 12, i get to sleep in like a snorlax 4 out of 5 days a week, and sleep's goooooooooooooooooooood, get to constantly regain my hitpoints
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Only thing that's not so good is when i have 9 hour days with pracs :(
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Only thing that's not so good is when i have 9 hour days with pracs :(
What first year uni subjects are you doing?
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bio, chem are for the pracs
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I don't like the time aspect.
I live 30 mins away, that's if I'm in a car and there's no traffic.
Taking the bus and then another bus.. or finding an alternate route... well the quickest I've ever got home is 1.5 hours, the longest around 2 hours.
I work around 25 hours a week between two part-time jobs, and so I can only really afford to go to uni 3 days a week. At the moment I do 2.5 days, but my Monday is from 9am-5pm, my Tuesday is classes from 9am-4pm, then music rehearsal on campus from 6ish - 9.30pm, then get home around 10. On Thursdays I have 1-6pm which isn't as bad, just it takes ages to get home.
I find it hard having energy throughout the week, let alone having time to revise, study and complete assignments! And you can say, yes drop your work shifts or some of them, but I am saving up for a car so that I can slice that travelling time in half, at the very least! *Sighhhhhh*
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I don't like the time aspect.
I live 30 mins away, that's if I'm in a car and there's no traffic.
Taking the bus and then another bus.. or finding an alternate route... well the quickest I've ever got home is 1.5 hours, the longest around 2 hours.
I work around 25 hours a week between two part-time jobs, and so I can only really afford to go to uni 3 days a week. At the moment I do 2.5 days, but my Monday is from 9am-5pm, my Tuesday is classes from 9am-4pm, then music rehearsal on campus from 6ish - 9.30pm, then get home around 10. On Thursdays I have 1-6pm which isn't as bad, just it takes ages to get home.
I find it hard having energy throughout the week, let alone having time to revise, study and complete assignments! And you can say, yes drop your work shifts or some of them, but I am saving up for a car so that I can slice that travelling time in half, at the very least! *Sighhhhhh*
Well in that case, short term pain for long term gain! As soon as you have that car it'll all be better so I suppose that's all the motivation you need :P.
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Thanks for your inspiration, teewreck!
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I was watching Insight earlier this week (highly recommended, it was a good episode on education) and a uni lecturer on the programme made the point that high achievers at high school knew how to play the system and focused on what was on the exam, to the exclusion of other things. As a lecturer, she got quite frustrated by students who were trying to learn to the exam and constantly asked what was going to be on the exam, because in the end by just studying for the exam you may do really well, but you're missing out on a lot of stuff and of part of the fun of education.
In my experience as well, in a lot of subjects at uni, there is a degree of creativity. It's good to approach a question or problem in a way that nobody else approached it. For students to actually be able to do that requires a fair bit of knowledge and a deep understanding.
+ Over 9000.
Just because you get a high score in VCE doesn't necessarily mean that you're 'smarter' in anyway.
It just means that you are able to have specifically the VCE exam skills, understanding how VCAA asks questions etc.
To some degree it was mainly the English subjects that somewhat allowed me to express my creativity - for those who didn't think so you probably had more resources than me lol - it was the only subject that I did that more completely allowed me to go where I wanted to go in answering the question and at the same time possibly get marks for it.
Maybe they should introduce more creativity into every subject as opposed to who can best churn out the same exam questions every time.
Because every year people get better at doing the same homogenous thing and they may make the exam harder and faster. Looking at some past exams may or may not show this trend. What is viewed as hard these days is what requires creativity. People get really angry when something that isn't explicitly on the study design is examined.
Because there is less time to answer the questions and to learn the course etc. people feel like they are wasting their time with the other stuff.
I mean especially if you're one of those people like me who only knew what definite integrals were mid - late in year 12 (yes I did specialist). As much as you would like to do it sometimes people don't have enough time.
Can this be changed?
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I was watching Insight earlier this week (highly recommended, it was a good episode on education) and a uni lecturer on the programme made the point that high achievers at high school knew how to play the system and focused on what was on the exam, to the exclusion of other things. As a lecturer, she got quite frustrated by students who were trying to learn to the exam and constantly asked what was going to be on the exam, because in the end by just studying for the exam you may do really well, but you're missing out on a lot of stuff and of part of the fun of education.
In my experience as well, in a lot of subjects at uni, there is a degree of creativity. It's good to approach a question or problem in a way that nobody else approached it. For students to actually be able to do that requires a fair bit of knowledge and a deep understanding.
+ Over 9000.
Just because you get a high score in VCE doesn't necessarily mean that you're 'smarter' in anyway.
It just means that you are able to have specifically the VCE exam skills, understanding how VCAA asks questions etc.
To some degree the English subjects somewhat allowed me to express my creativity - for those who didn't think so you probably had more resources than me lol - it was the only subject that I did that more completely allowed me to go where I wanted to go in answering the question and at the same time possibly get marks for it.
Maybe they should introduce more creativity into every subject as opposed to who can best churn out the same exam questions every time.
Because every year people get better at doing the same homogenous thing and they may make the exam harder and faster. Looking at some past exams may or may not show this trend. What is viewed as hard these days is what requires creativity. People get really angry when something that isn't explicitly on the study design is examined.
Because there is less time to answer the questions and to learn the course etc. people feel like they are wasting their time with the other stuff.
I mean especially if you're one of those people like me who only knew what definite integrals mid - late in year 12. As much as you would like to do it sometimes people don't have enough time.
Can this be changed?
Looks like people need to appreciate knowledge more, otherwise it doesn't make sense and yes I can relate to the lecturer's frustration, a lecturer prefers a student who wants to learn as oppose to just get through and forget about it afterwards. Which kinda makes learning pointless if you're gonna be like that.
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I think that these two posts above me really resonate well with how I feel about VCE.
I felt that personally I enjoyed my Englishes the most out of all my subjects. Even though they were the most challenging, they were the ones that I got the most out of and they were the most intellectually stimulating because I had to extend my thoughts to "outside of the box" or the VCE guidelines and study designs.
I had the same teacher for both these Englishes and I have so much respect for her for how she taught us to really "think", such as how to think analytically, open-mindedly and critically depending on the circumstances. *These* are the skill sets that you need to equip yourself with in university and beyond, and I can imagine myself years later after VCE fondly reminiscing over some teeny tiny piece of information about language or whatever that has stuck with me since Year 11 or 12. I think it's fabulous that you can come away from the last years of high school and still have that sophisticated knowledge bank that can be put to use for the rest of your life, not just chunks of info needed to devour and spurt out on a page during the exam period.