Unit 3 Questions MEGATHREAD :)

[luken93]

damn, ya beat me by 1 mark..
i got every aspiriin question wrong, we never did an aspirin SAC, our last sac was on polymers..
4 multiple choice errors, that def could have been handled better..

just realised, that it would indeed be butanol, hm..


uh in regards to your oxidation quesiton, i think its always best to write like what it reduces, or that there is a change in the oxidation number

can we use 'hydrogen environments' and 'proton environments' interchangebly?

I'd say 1H environments to be safe

A new question, from the 2008 VCAA.


Is the IO4- (aq) ion acting as an oxidant or reductant? Explain your choice.


My Answer: Oxidant, as it causes the reduction reaction.



VCAA: Oxidant, the oxidation number of I decreases from +7 to +5.



Was my answer too herpy derpy? It is another 1 mark question. I Don't know when the VCAA wants a general answer or a deep answer. God >_<!

Yeah, to be safe always include the oxidation number - in doing so you're confirming the answer with yourself anyway

[jasoN-]

Because methylpropan-1-ol and butan-2-ol are structural isomers
    C
    |
C-C-C is different to C-C-C-C

   C
   |
C-C-C  that's not the carbon backbone of methylpropan-1-ol (that would be the backbone of 2-methylpropanol)

C                                                                                     OH
|                                                                                      |
C-C-C   this is methylpropan-1-ol.. also known as butan-2-ol: C-C-C-C
|          anyway i dunno why vcaa would name it like methylpropan-1-ol
OH

[nacho]

aminoR
is accepted, correct?
I hate Ramine

eg aminoethane over ethanamine

[luken93]

would
2methyl-propan-1-ol be accepted if the given answers are:


• methylpropan–1–ol
• methyl–1–propanol
• 2–methyl–1–propanol

We are talking about 2-MethylPropan-1-ol

The reason why it is stated as methyl only, is because if you were to put a methyl on a propane chain, the only place it can be put is on the 2-C, hence the debate if you need to bother adding the 2. In essence, it's the same as saying 1-Butanoic Acid, because we know that a carboxyl group has to be on the 1st carbon, but neither are penalised.

[luken93]

2-aminobutane
2-butanamine
2-butylamine

[jane1234]

aminoR
is accepted, correct?
I hate Ramine

eg aminoethane over ethanamine

TSFX said that only the latter is correct.
So, to be on the safe side I'd always write R-amine.

Then again, TSFX could be wrong

[jasoN-]

Okay i see where this has gone wrong, i think VCAA accepts methyl instead of 2-methyl as it's pretty stupid writing methylpropanol instead of butanol;
still i myself wouldn't accept methylpropanol to be the same as 2-methylpropanol.

[nacho]

aminoR
is accepted, correct?
I hate Ramine

eg aminoethane over ethanamine

TSFX said that only the latter is correct.
So, to be on the safe side I'd always write R-amine.

Then again, TSFX could be wrong

yea, that's what the P2G lecturer said (taught at macrob) and she explicitly mentioned that VCAA said not to write amino..
but, my tutor says that you can write amino.. and he got a 50, and probably has an IQ >130 .. so confused.

would
2methyl-propan-1-ol be accepted if the given answers are:


• methylpropan–1–ol
• methyl–1–propanol
• 2–methyl–1–propanol

We are talking about 2-MethylPropan-1-ol

The reason why it is stated as methyl only, is because if you were to put a methyl on a propane chain, the only place it can be put is on the 2-C, hence the debate if you need to bother adding the 2. In essence, it's the same as saying 1-Butanoic Acid, because we know that a carboxyl group has to be on the 1st carbon, but neither are penalised.

i got caught off guard by that one, i didnt realise it was on the same carbon backbone, otherwise i wouldnt have wrote 2-methyl..
however... my original question was in regard to the placement of the number '1'
in propan-1-ol
is that accept? Or does it have to be 1-propanol

[jasoN-]

1-propanol = propan-1-ol both are equally accepted
just make sure theres always - between numbers, and no - between words (for the most part, in some cases such as ethers, there may be spaces between words)
(ie. looking at what u wrote about 2methyl-propan-1-ol is technically incorrect, it shoul be 2-methylpropan-1-ol, don't know if vcaa penalises on these flaws though)

[luken93]

The debate over amine is long winded, and VCAA is confusion over it as well. The proper way is butylamine, however, since the IUPAC have silly rules, they've been forced to accept a few answers and I don't know whether they'll ever change it...

btw, why so many people not at school?

[luken93]

1-propanol = propan-1-ol both are equally accepted
just make sure theres always - between numbers, and no - between words
(ie. looking at what u wrote about 2methyl-propan-1-ol is technically incorrect, it shoul be 2-methylpropan-1-ol, don't know if vcaa penalises on these flaws though)

woops hahaha

[RobM8]

Nacho :

To answer the original aim of your question: propan-1-ol and 1-propanol are saying the same thing.

btw, why so many people not at school?

Spares

[nacho]

btw, why so many people not at school?

got a chem exam in a week and an accounting exam in 6 days

[scocliffe09]

aminoR
is accepted, correct?
I hate Ramine

eg aminoethane over ethanamine

TSFX said that only the latter is correct.
So, to be on the safe side I'd always write R-amine.

Then again, TSFX could be wrong

yea, that's what the P2G lecturer said (taught at macrob) and she explicitly mentioned that VCAA said not to write amino..
but, my tutor says that you can write amino.. and he got a 50, and probably has an IQ >130 .. so confused.

would
2methyl-propan-1-ol be accepted if the given answers are:


• methylpropan–1–ol
• methyl–1–propanol
• 2–methyl–1–propanol

We are talking about 2-MethylPropan-1-ol

The reason why it is stated as methyl only, is because if you were to put a methyl on a propane chain, the only place it can be put is on the 2-C, hence the debate if you need to bother adding the 2. In essence, it's the same as saying 1-Butanoic Acid, because we know that a carboxyl group has to be on the 1st carbon, but neither are penalised.

i got caught off guard by that one, i didnt realise it was on the same carbon backbone, otherwise i wouldnt have wrote 2-methyl..
however... my original question was in regard to the placement of the number '1'
in propan-1-ol
is that accept? Or does it have to be 1-propanol

amino- as a prefix, if amine is the primary functional group, is NOT acceptable according to IUPAC naming, because the primary functional group must come last. the most acceptable naming is -anamine, and -ylamine is also acceptable (according to my teacher and the IUPAC naming system). As long as your naming is unambiguous and without obvious errors for VCE, you will get your marks.

[luken93]

so even though amino- prefix is unacceptable according to IUPAC, have VCAA adapted to that or not?

Also, I know this has been brought up, but if you're going to put the number in front of the name, do you have to do this for the whole naming?

ie 2-methylpropan-1-ol and
2-methyl-1-propanol