Comment on my language analysis

[abcat]

more often than not you cannot point out a persuasive technique without labelling it. as melodrama said, just don't repeat yourself

[brendan]

Look, you can label techniques and still score a 10; it's just unnecessary and detracts from the number of words which are utilised to actually analyse the ways in which language is used to persuade the reader. Deep and insightful analysis is what scores the marks, so you may as well concentrate on that.

I've offered you evidence: examiners' reports, the view of my former teacher (an examiner and head of english) and my personal experience.
If you refuse to accept evidence then there is no more I can do for you.

Avoid labelling techniques, such as 'repetition' 'rhetorical questions' etc

take this for example:

"There are many people in the world who really don't understand, or say they don't, what is the great issue between the free world and the Communist world. Let them come to Berlin. There are some who say that communism is the wave of the future. Let them come to Berlin. And there are some who say in Europe and elsewhere we can work with the Communists. Let them come to Berlin. And there are even a few who say that it is true that communism is an evil system, but it permits us to make economic progress. Lass' sie nach Berlin kommen. Let them come to Berlin."

Clearly you see some repetition of the phrase "Let them come to Berlin". I say, just call, a spade a spade and get on with the business of analyzing it. How are you gonna analyze that without calling it repetition at some point?

[BA22]

I'm confused

All Brendan and i were saying is that identification is something you must do, best served by labeling. Whilst seemingly simplistic, if you wish to discuss a pun or rhetorical question and its effects then you are likely to reference those techniques by name in your response, that's all were advocating. Labeling techniques and analysing their effects are not mutually exclusive. Exaggeration of truth is also a label used by melo above. These labels to do have to be simplistic blocks of text either

Eg "the use of 100,000's to describe the destruction of the town of X is a hyperbole"

Rather

"The hyperbolic figure of 100,000 <effect>"

This clearly labels the technique and is suitable to allow follow on analysis

We were in no way advocating the former, which is what students tend to do when they lack confidence or ability in this subject. They merely label. Labelling in itself is completely necessary, it adds logical structure to your discussion, and demonstrates knowledge of common written communication techniques.

[Collin Li]

Yes. When the assessors say they don't want to see labelling, they mean: "the writer has used a hyperbole..." instead of a nicely integrated label that BA22 showed above:

"The hyperbolic figure of..."

[costargh]

Lol Brendan.

Thanks Nick.

[Nick]

Look, you can label techniques and still score a 10; it's just unnecessary and detracts from the number of words which are utilised to actually analyse the ways in which language is used to persuade the reader. Deep and insightful analysis is what scores the marks, so you may as well concentrate on that.

I've offered you evidence: examiners' reports, the view of my former teacher (an examiner and head of english) and my personal experience.
If you refuse to accept evidence then there is no more I can do for you.

Thankyou! Finally someone who agrees with me!

May I ask, by the way, how you did in english?

I was wondering the exact same thing actually.

[BA22]

Come on guys, advice is advice. Asking "what score did you get?" is a slippery slope to one person implying their advice is better than others because they scored more highly. Brendan offered reasonable advice, the nature of a forum is that people who write matter-of-factly come of as being rude or forceful, which is not his intention at all.

[costargh]

I don't think knowing study scores would affect how much I took notice of the advice I was being given.
I have a lot of respect for Nick and Brendan and BA22 for that matter. That's for English.

[djmcus]

sorry, this post isn't very constructive.
Anyway, neophyte is the co-moderator of the english section of this forum for a reason: He got 50 in english. I was in the same year level as him in the same school and without weekly tutorial sessions (one on one) with him, there is no way that i would've got 46 in english which, in turn, would've prevented me from getting 99.90...

LISTEN TO HIM.

The worst thing that an english student can do is take opposing advice from different people. For this reason, i dropped my 'official' english tutor during the year and let neophyte teach me his wondrous ways.

Although you may be older and more experienced in the english language than neophyte (you aren't, this is just a hypothetical), the method necessary for VCE english essays, analyses and points of view are different to those that you would use in university and often even in real life situations. Please try to use a less attacking tone when engaging in an argument.

BTW, if you are an accounting student, check out my notes. they are REALLY GOOD.

[Nick]

Costa,

Check your inbox. I have sent your analysis back to you marked.

[costargh]

Thanks Nick. Checking now
My teacher marked it and gave it back to me today. 7/10 with quite a bit of recommended improvements.

[Nick]

Thanks Nick. Checking now
My teacher marked it and gave it back to me today. 7/10 with quite a bit of recommended improvements.

Hahaha, your teacher and I think alike! I gave it 7/10 too.