.

[busterBluth]

i dont think anyone really, truly thinks the UMAT is the ABSOLUTE worst indicator of how good a doctor someone can be and its subjective and the whole system is stuffed and blah blah blah

everyone is just bitter after yesterday.

[10weid]

umm naa..ive though its a stupid system for ages.. ive got plenty of friens hoo didnt get in coz of either vce or umat and wud have been unbelievable doctors..

and no michael, im not dumb, i just think there need to be a number of different selection criteria for med school.. say 80 ppl based solely on VCE, 80 ppl based solely on umat + interview, and 80 ppl a mix of both... just something to diversify the types of sutdents..

[10weid]

^^i'll assume that his last post was legit and respond accordingly lol

If you're in the hospital then the person treating you will be a doctor. Medical school is hard. If you graduate, you're capable. Being personable is just a nice bonus.

And how does the UMAT or VCE select for people who are comedians? The interview is to select charismatic individuals, but the people getting into medicine are all capable and deserve their place.

I think that the UMAT is luck of the draw in what the questions are (since it's not based on a set curriculum) but I disagree with calling it subjective and terrible. In any case, if you go via the graduate pathway (a very significant amount of places) you'll find that it plays to a more scientifically minded individual.

so u want ur dreams to be decided by 'luck of the draw'?

[Stroodle]

^ naa...
and also, i dont think the shopowner person could be labelled sadistic..its wayyy tooi extreme no?

yea exactly imo too extreme, but others dispute this.

it did seem extreme...but then i remember the passage said something about the manager punishing them more severely when there were customers around watching as opposed to when they were by themselves.....something along those lines......anyway seemed pretty sadistic to me

Agreed. She also made them clean the floor when it was already clean.
I do agree that it's pretty extreme, but I think it was fitting... Also, to me the other options didn't seem to really draw from the passage.

Oxford definition of sadism:
-enjoyment from watching or making somebody suffer.
-in general use: deliberate cruelty.

[fady_22]

umm naa..ive though its a stupid system for ages.. ive got plenty of friens hoo didnt get in coz of either vce or umat and wud have been unbelievable doctors..

and no michael, im not dumb, i just think there need to be a number of different selection criteria for med school.. say 80 ppl based solely on VCE, 80 ppl based solely on umat + interview, and 80 ppl a mix of both... just something to diversify the types of sutdents..

Yes, but I know some people who have the ability to do well academically, but have little common sense and poor critical thinking skills and would make terrible doctors.

The UMAT is good to an extent; surely, there is a lot of luck involved, and it is not directly relatable to a career in medicine, but overall it provides a good basis upon which to choose students. Like anything (*cough* VCE *cough*) it has it's flaws, but without it, we would be worse off.  

And besides, how else can you filter out the thousands of medical hopefuls? Your idea is not at all practical.

[vexx]

umm naa..ive though its a stupid system for ages.. ive got plenty of friens hoo didnt get in coz of either vce or umat and wud have been unbelievable doctors..

and no michael, im not dumb, i just think there need to be a number of different selection criteria for med school.. say 80 ppl based solely on VCE, 80 ppl based solely on umat + interview, and 80 ppl a mix of both... just something to diversify the types of sutdents..

:S

[10weid]

well this way is flawed, so unless we try something else we'll never know..
and of course it spractical..  there is ceretianly a polace in medicine for braniancs, as there is for pople hoo r gona have great bedisde manner..

[Michael0007]

umm naa..ive though its a stupid system for ages.. ive got plenty of friens hoo didnt get in coz of either vce or umat and wud have been unbelievable doctors..

and no michael, im not dumb, i just think there need to be a number of different selection criteria for med school.. say 80 ppl based solely on VCE, 80 ppl based solely on umat + interview, and 80 ppl a mix of both... just something to diversify the types of sutdents..

You think your opinion of your friends is a better indicator than the UMAT or VCE?

There will NEVER be a perfect system, currently the system in place is THE MOST SUITABLE, complaining about this is the same as complaining about................I can't even complete the statement.

[Stroodle]

I do agree with having the UMAT, but I think it would be better (probably not very practical though) to have a series of different separate tests - some practical - rather than just one single long test.

[10weid]

^ i accept wat ur saying, but in truth, u have no idea wats the most suitable unless everythings been tried and the results assessed...

and also, yeah i think opininon can be a much better indicator then vce (a measure of how willing one is to memorize stupid amounts of irrelevant information) or the umat (a guessing game)...
nex titme u see a person, do u plan on reacitng to them by how u personally percieve them or by their marks? coz th ewya u just sed it, it seems vce and umat are a better assessor of how suitble a person is ot be a doctor than their own demanour :s

[fady_22]

well this way is flawed, so unless we try something else we'll never know..
and of course it spractical..  there is ceretianly a polace in medicine for braniancs, as there is for pople hoo r gona have great bedisde manner..

That's not what I meant.

Did you see how many people took the UMAT?
And now think about how many places are actually available.

If they were to judge applicants on VCE alone, the ATAR score would be so ridiculously high that some students, who would make excellent doctors, would miss out because of a trivial difference in their score and the score required.

And besides, medicine is a career that not everyone can succeed in. UMAT is a good indicator of who would succeed. Why change it?

(I'm depressed about it too, but there really is no better way for admissions).

[supernerd]

Don't know whether to be nervous or not really,

finished every section with at least 5 mins to spare, however i did not do any extra prep apart from the 1st acer test.

should i be worried?

oh yes, very..

for which particular reason?

[10weid]

so spearating up the types of admission would be very sutiable

[busterBluth]

^ naa...
and also, i dont think the shopowner person could be labelled sadistic..its wayyy tooi extreme no?

yea exactly imo too extreme, but others dispute this.

it did seem extreme...but then i remember the passage said something about the manager punishing them more severely when there were customers around watching as opposed to when they were by themselves.....something along those lines......anyway seemed pretty sadistic to me

Agreed. She also made them clean the floor when it was already clean.
I do agree that it's pretty extreme, but I think it was fitting... Also, to me the other options didn't seem to really draw from the passage.

Oxford definition of sadism:
-enjoyment from watching or making somebody suffer.
-in general use: deliberate cruelty.

Thankyou!......there u go @mikee

[mikee65]

^ naa...
and also, i dont think the shopowner person could be labelled sadistic..its wayyy tooi extreme no?

yea exactly imo too extreme, but others dispute this.

it did seem extreme...but then i remember the passage said something about the manager punishing them more severely when there were customers around watching as opposed to when they were by themselves.....something along those lines......anyway seemed pretty sadistic to me

Agreed. She also made them clean the floor when it was already clean.
I do agree that it's pretty extreme, but I think it was fitting... Also, to me the other options didn't seem to really draw from the passage.

Oxford definition of sadism:
-enjoyment from watching or making somebody suffer.
-in general use: deliberate cruelty.

think about the passage, her actions are most likely as a result of the training course, i dont think it showed that she got "pleasure" from it, but made the employees cleaned floors in front of customers in order to demonstrate the store is in good order, the store image is obviously important, this is what she is told and demonstrates this through her actions. Sadistic is far far extreme..imo