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October 04, 2026, 10:49:28 am

Author Topic: VCE Methods Question Thread!  (Read 6264346 times)  Share 

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Sine

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16470 on: May 18, 2018, 02:30:32 pm »
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is related rates still in the methods study design?
nope it isn not longer on the study design but may turn up on school sacs

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16471 on: May 18, 2018, 02:34:47 pm »
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nope it isn not longer on the study design but may turn up on school sacs
Could it turn up on the exam by any chance?

Sine

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16472 on: May 18, 2018, 02:37:35 pm »
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Could it turn up on the exam by any chance?
it "shouldn't" be on the exam as per the study design cahnges unless in the exam they explain the concept. However related rates is just an application of the chain rule so you never know.

EDIT: sorry I can't give a definitive answer :)
« Last Edit: May 18, 2018, 02:43:10 pm by Sine »

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16473 on: May 18, 2018, 04:13:28 pm »
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it "shouldn't" be on the exam as per the study design cahnges unless in the exam they explain the concept. However related rates is just an application of the chain rule so you never know.

EDIT: sorry I can't give a definitive answer :)
Thanks
Also, since probability is the hardest part of methods, what's the best way to understand it?
How would you sketch (1/4x)+x without a calculator?
« Last Edit: May 19, 2018, 08:45:32 am by michaeljacksonftw »

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16474 on: May 19, 2018, 11:12:26 am »
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Thanks
Also, since probability is the hardest part of methods, what's the best way to understand it?
How would you sketch (1/4x)+x without a calculator?
Bump
Got another question
y = x^2(sin(2pix))
find dy/dx
i first derived sin(2pix) using the chain rule and got cos(2pix)(2pi)
then i derived x^2 to get 2x
to my final answer was 2x (cos(2pix)(2pi)), which was wrong
Can someone please explain what's wrong with my working out and how the corredt answer should be worked out?
Thanks

RuiAce

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16475 on: May 19, 2018, 11:25:09 am »
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Bump
Got another question
y = x^2(sin(2pix))
find dy/dx
i first derived sin(2pix) using the chain rule and got cos(2pix)(2pi)
then i derived x^2 to get 2x
to my final answer was 2x (cos(2pix)(2pi)), which was wrong
Can someone please explain what's wrong with my working out and how the corredt answer should be worked out?
Thanks

\[ \frac{d}{dx} x^2 \sin 2\pi x = x^2 (2\pi \cos 2\pi x) + (2x) \sin 2\pi x \]
« Last Edit: May 19, 2018, 11:57:39 am by RuiAce »

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16476 on: May 19, 2018, 11:38:50 am »
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\[ \frac{d}{dx} x^2 \sin 2\pi x = x^2 (2\pi \cos 2\pi x) + (2x) \sin 2\pi x \]
Don't really understand your explanation - could you please explain it another way perhaps?

darkz

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16477 on: May 19, 2018, 11:42:51 am »
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Don't really understand your explanation - could you please explain it another way perhaps?

Your equation is made up of two functions of x, x^2 and sin(2pix), so you have to use the product rule when differentiating
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michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16478 on: May 19, 2018, 11:49:50 am »
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Your equation is made up of two functions of x, x^2 and sin(2pix), so you have to use the product rule when differentiating
But wouldn't be sin(2pix) be differentiated using the chain rule?

darkz

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16479 on: May 19, 2018, 11:53:54 am »
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But wouldn't be sin(2pix) be differentiated using the chain rule?
Indeed, however the overall picture is still differentiation using the product rule. The chain rule is only used when differentiating the sin(2pix) component.

Lets think about it this way,
f(x) = x^2 * sin(2pix)
Let x^2 be a(x)
Let sin(2pix) be b(x)

f'(x) = a'(x)*b(x) + a(x)*b'(x)
a'(x) = 2x
b'(x) = 2pi * cos(2pix)

Now just sub in the values of a'(x) & b'(x) into f'(x) and you've got your answer
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RuiAce

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16480 on: May 19, 2018, 11:57:26 am »
+1
But wouldn't be sin(2pix) be differentiated using the chain rule?
The idea is that this is a question, in which you must use both rules.

In fact, you must use the chain rule inside the product rule, as demonstrated above. You should always be alert for the possibility of requiring two derivative rules at the same time.

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16481 on: May 19, 2018, 12:32:08 pm »
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I think this question requires both the chain rule and the product rule
y = x^2sin^2(3x)
y = x^2(sin(3x)^2

let u = x^2
let v = (sin(3x)^2

du/dx = 2x
dv/dx
let u = sin(3x)
du/dx = 3cos(3x)
y = u^2
dy/du = 2u
dy/dx = (2u)*(3cos(3x)
= (2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x)

so dv/dx = (2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x)
and du/dx = 2x

so (x^2)((2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x))+((sin(3x)^2)(2x)
Is this correct? If not, would the correct answer be worked out?


RuiAce

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16482 on: May 19, 2018, 01:57:59 pm »
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I think this question requires both the chain rule and the product rule
y = x^2sin^2(3x)
y = x^2(sin(3x)^2

let u = x^2
let v = (sin(3x)^2

du/dx = 2x
dv/dx
let u = sin(3x)
du/dx = 3cos(3x)
y = u^2
dy/du = 2u
dy/dx = (2u)*(3cos(3x)
= (2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x)

so dv/dx = (2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x)
and du/dx = 2x

so (x^2)((2)(sin(3x)(3cos(3x))+((sin(3x)^2)(2x)
Is this correct? If not, would the correct answer be worked out?


Looks correct.

michaeljacksonftw

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16483 on: May 19, 2018, 02:14:09 pm »
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Looks correct.
Is my answer all simplified?

TheBigC

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Re: VCE Methods Question Thread!
« Reply #16484 on: May 19, 2018, 02:45:42 pm »
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Bump
Got another question
y = x^2(sin(2pix))
find dy/dx
i first derived sin(2pix) using the chain rule and got cos(2pix)(2pi)
then i derived x^2 to get 2x
to my final answer was 2x (cos(2pix)(2pi)), which was wrong
Can someone please explain what's wrong with my working out and how the corredt answer should be worked out?
Thanks

$$ \mbox{Let y = }x^{2}\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x}) $$
Product rule:
$$ \frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{d}{dx}[x^{2}]\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x}) + x^{2}\frac{d}{dx}[\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x})] $$
Chain rule:
$$  = 2x\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x}) + x^{2}(\cos(\frac{2\pi}{x})\frac{d}{dx}[\frac{2\pi}{x}])  $$
$$  = 2x\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x}) + x^{2}(\cos(\frac{2\pi}{x})\frac{-2\pi}{x^{2}})  $$
$$  = 2x\sin(\frac{2\pi}{x}) + (-2\pi\cos(\frac{2\pi}{x}))  $$

EDIT: Sorry for the delayed post, I presumed page 1101 was the most recent page and that this question hadn't been answered yet.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2018, 02:48:37 pm by TheBigC »