Back-up options: Monash Engineering/Commerce or Melbourne Biomed?

[pi]

So weird to be posting in the uni section, but here it goes

I'm really stuck as to what I should have after Monash med as my second VTAC preference. I'm fairly confident I have an ATAR to clear the "clearly-in" mark this year (for these back-up options), but I confused as to which one to pick. I have no guarantee of getting med somewhere this year, so I'm taking this very seriously. Here are my issues for each of them (all major and minor issues):

Biomed (Melbourne):
1) Its sciency, which I like
2) An option of graduate med if I pass the GAMSAT/interview
3) I have no idea what job opportunities there are if I don't get into grad med, I dislike the idea of researching and/or teaching for the rest of life
4) Apparently the workload is enormous?
5) How much effort is required for the GAMSAT, on-top of biomed commitments (I would want to do well in all my subs btw)?
6) Closer to home

Engineering/commerce (Monash): (focusing on chemical engineering as an occupation)
1) Its sciency (chem), which I like
2) Plenty of job opportunities and demand, I know what I'll end up as
3) Getting into grad med would be a lot more difficult, but I probably wouldn't go for it if I took up this option
4) It still has some maths
5) A little incentive in the Excellence scholarship which I got
6) Further away from home


Please correct me if any of the above is factually wrong.

Any help or opinions would be much appreciated Thanks AN

[dc302]

These questions are always hard to answer, since we don't know how strongly you feel about what you want to do in the future. If you are really set on med then I would do science or biomed, but keep in mind if you do these, be prepared to do another degree afterwards, no matter what. You pretty much need another degree, whether it be masters, a health science degree, engineering, teaching, phd, switch to commerce masters etc to get any kind of decent job, at least as far as I'm aware.

Also, if you like engineering then you can do this after science at melbourne too. I think the main question is how strongly you want to do medicine.

[taiga]

So hard to help you choose which one. What are your views on medicine? Do you want to do it, or are you being pressured into it?


Just a few things that might help you make a decision

Chemical Engineering doesn't have as much chemistry as the name indicates. I found materials engineering to have more chemistry.

It's moreso to do with physics in all honesty (though you do study through till second year chem, and apply principals of chemistry all the way through).

Ignore the scholarship for now, 30K over the course of a lifetime isn't that much.

You haven't actually asked us any questions, aside from giving opinions, which is a bit hard based on what you've said, but yeah feel free to expand.

[aes_999]

Come to Monash where I can potentially troll you (and vice versa).
You could rent around Monash... I think rent around the are is around 400 - 500 ish per week.
Expensive, but manageable should u rent with other people.
Or you could lodge in the Monash dorms using your excellent $$$.
OR have the option to crash my house for a day or so.

[moekamo]

why not engineering/biomed at monash? it seems that none of your reasons for monash take into account why you are doing commerce...

[Russ]

3) If you don't want to do those then not a whole lot. You'd have to get kinda lucky with moving into the private sector and a relevant masters
4) How long is a piece of string
5) Study over summer, none

[aes_999]

Engineering / Comm. at Monash.
Have the option of being buddies with taiga and getting trolled by me (and vice versa).
You could lodge at Monash for cheap, or should you wish to rent with friends,
renting a house near the Clayton area cost around $400 or 500 p/w.
That, or you can always crash my house for a day or something.

[Hamdog17]

BEng/BComm:
-Engineering/commerce is definitely a safer option (eg. You've got a career at the end of it in chemical engineering and you've been studying this for 5 years and would be pretty employable)
-As you've mentioned you can leave after your third year in the double degree and get into post grad med. you've got a scholarship which is nice.
-Monash have top industry links so the engineering degree would be awesome from there

•I'm following the first point when I decided I'd do BBMS/LLB if I don't get med first time around.


BBiomed
-Biomed is great for post grad med but how badly do you want med? If you want to medicine more than anything else, do biomed because you just study biomed subjects and breadth subjects meaning it's more focused on that path unlike commerce/engineering and leaving third year.
-However, maybe you're not sure and need more time to decide if this is the case the double engineering would be better as it leaves you in a really good position if you didn't want to do med 2 years from now.
-I've heard workload is more than other undergrad degrees (i've heard about 20 contact hours a week plus additional study) but nothing insane. Probably a lot of competition between students though so you may find yourself studying a fair bit more that get that insane GPA.

In both of these nothing stops you applying next year as a nonstandard student for medicine. Hope that helps.

[Hamdog17]

why not engineering/biomed at monash? it seems that none of your reasons for monash take into account why you are doing commerce...

Excellent point here. Why not look at the other engineering double degrees available?

[pi]

Thanks guys A lot of great advice here already

why not engineering/biomed at monash? it seems that none of your reasons for monash take into account why you are doing commerce...

I haven't considered that one yet, seems like a good mix of the two options. Also allows me to go for post grad med if I want to as well, will give some serious consideration to this. Kinda chose commerce because it apparently increases employability? Is this even true for a chemical engineer?

So hard to help you choose which one. What are your views on medicine? Do you want to do it, or are you being pressured into it?

I'm not being pressured, that's for sure. I really want to do med, but the main issue is, that I can totally see myself neglected/procrastinating GMASAT study (like I did with the UMAT), and then I'd be left with a career I don't really want to do all that much

To be perfectly honest, I'm equal between med and engineering. Med has its positives (more science based, more people interactions, enjoyed my experience at RCH, etc.) and so does engineering imo (has maths in it, simpler and shorter pathway, still has people interactions - albiet of a different type, etc.).

Chemical Engineering doesn't have as much chemistry as the name indicates. I found materials engineering to have more chemistry.

It's moreso to do with physics in all honesty (though you do study through till second year chem, and apply principals of chemistry all the way through).

At the open day (Monash) earlier this year, I talked to one of guys about this (as I dislike many areas of VCE physics), and apparently the physics involved isn't the phsyics I really dislike (electronics, photonics, magnets, etc.). He said that the physics it uses is entwined with the chemistry? Using things like fluid mechanics and thermo mechanics/chemistry? (my memory is still full of richard quotes...)

Ignore the scholarship for now, 30K over the course of a lifetime isn't that much.

Yeh I agree (should have made this more clear at the start, my bad), this really isn't much in the long-term. I'm not going to base my decision on this value anyway

BEng/BComm:
-Engineering/commerce is definitely a safer option (eg. You've got a career at the end of it in chemical engineering and you've been studying this for 5 years and would be pretty employable)
-As you've mentioned you can leave after your third year in the double degree and get into post grad med. you've got a scholarship which is nice.
-Monash have top industry links so the engineering degree would be awesome from there

- Yeh, I like the safety, I know what I'll end up if I pass
- I think that this point, combined with moekamo's, seems to be very appealing
- YES! I've heard this true, which is the main reason why I'm not pursuing engineering at Melbourne (+ Melbourne's shifty "Master of Engineering" isn't appealing). Can I get some more confirmation of Hamdog17's point?

BBiomed
-I've heard workload is more than other undergrad degrees (i've heard about 20 contact hours a week plus additional study) but nothing insane. Probably a lot of competition between students though so you may find yourself studying a fair bit more that get that insane GPA.

I've heard this too (stonecold), it's pretty heavy. I'm really concerned that after such a heavy course (I'd want to score well too), whether or not I would have the motivation to study for the GAMSAT in the summer break...

Engineering / Comm. at Monash.
Have the option of being buddies with taiga and getting trolled by me (and vice versa).
You could lodge at Monash for cheap, or should you wish to rent with friends,
renting a house near the Clayton area cost around $400 or 500 p/w.
That, or you can always crash my house for a day or something.

...

3) If you don't want to do those then not a whole lot. You'd have to get kinda lucky with moving into the private sector and a relevant masters
5) Study over summer, none

3) That's an issue
5) How much study did you do Russ? (and other successful grad med applicants)




Again, thanks Sorry for being a bit ambiguous and vague in my earlier post

[funkyducky]

Have you considered doing Science at Melbourne majoring in Bioengineering systems? That would cover prerequisites for both MD and the MEng, so you would have the chance to pursue chem engineering if you didn't get into MD. Also, I'm pretty sure you don't have to take the GAMSAT with a 99+ ATAR, you just have to sit an interview. The drawback is you'll only get guaranteed entrance to full-fee MD, but that doesn't mean you won't get a CSP place.

http://www.futurestudents.unimelb.edu.au/admissions/entry-requirements/guaranteed-entry/guaranteed_entry_pathways_by_course
No need to do GAMSAT for you.

Also BSci+MEng would take 5 years, same time as a double degree *shrug*

[pi]

I think I've decided on Biomedical science/engineering @ Monash for preference after med, seems like a win-win from my previous dilemma. Thanks to everyone's advice, I took all advice on board

Just a final question, will I be able to do the prereq subjects needed for Melb grad med whilst doing this degree at Monash? Will there be any changes in degree names?

[Russ]

Yes you will / no change in degree names. Be aware the biomed at Monash is more research oriented than biomed at melb though.

Have you considered doing Science at Melbourne majoring in Bioengineering systems? That would cover prerequisites for both MD and the MEng, so you would have the chance to pursue chem engineering if you didn't get into MD. Also, I'm pretty sure you don't have to take the GAMSAT with a 99+ ATAR, you just have to sit an interview. The drawback is you'll only get guaranteed entrance to full-fee MD, but that doesn't mean you won't get a CSP place.

http://www.futurestudents.unimelb.edu.au/admissions/entry-requirements/guaranteed-entry/guaranteed_entry_pathways_by_course
No need to do GAMSAT for you.

Also BSci+MEng would take 5 years, same time as a double degree *shrug*

Yes need, the GAMSAT is only waived if you take the FFP (and the 300k debt and the lack of a guaranteed internship)

[Hamdog17]

I think I've decided on Biomedical science/engineering @ Monash for preference after med, seems like a win-win from my previous dilemma. Thanks to everyone's advice, I took all advice on board

Just a final question, will I be able to do the prereq subjects needed for Melb grad med whilst doing this degree at Monash? Will there be any changes in degree names?

As long as the monash biochem, anatomy, etc. subjects you are selecting are approved in this pdf guide (here: http://sc.mdhs.unimelb.edu.au/sites/studentcentre/files/VIC_prerequisite_web_update_28_Nov_2011.pdf) then they are fine. Remember you can still do postgrad at monash also if you wanted.

[A-i-d-a-n-K]

I'm in pretty much the exact same position as you, and decided on Biomed/Eng at Monash too. Just know that the Engineering Excellence scholarship won't apply to this course, because it's run by the Faculty of Health Sciences, but as Taiga said 30K is nothing over the course of a lifetime. Good luck getting into Med