Who murdered the arts degree?

[Water]

As someone who intends to do a Diploma in Arts next year, I think the jokes are somewhat justified because most people don't actually know what you end up working in when you've finished an arts degree, it's just the fact that they're not familiar with the pathways an Arts degree can open up that leads them to bag it.

why'd this get so much hate?
I know it's not what paul said, because what he said was 'jokes are justified because people don't know anything about arts'
but it's pretty clear that he intended to say 'its not surprising people bag arts,  because they are ignorant of what arts entails so they bag it. people are on average ignorant of the arts degree. let us all be friends!'

im assuming butt-sensitive arts students + paul repped downvoted him.
goes a long way to show why people hate arts students

On the mention of being butt-hurt

A friend told me who's parents are doctors, and his mum is the head of a medical institute. Biomed kids become "lab factory workers" after 3 years and their income are not significantly higher than a "teacher" in school.

Ohh, did I forget to mention, Biomed's at Melb Uni is 99 whilst an Arts is a trifle atar?

And while I'm releasing my Artsy frustration to the rest of the world... FUCK YOU FOR BAGGING ARTS KIDS.

I would like to paraphrase from Lot's Wife by Monash "Arts kids get more social life, has more freedom compared to other subjects, gets the girls and has more uniting of the two opposite parties....Did I mention, the uniting of the two opposite parties? "


Yurrr Buddies. wHo LaUgHing NoW?


End Artsy Frustration.


After 6 months of being bagged

[paulsterio]

I know it's an issue, but also note that I'm by no means anti-arts, I believe that it's a great degree with many majors which I find interesting, but I still don't think that it's right just to jump on anyone who throws around arts jokes, like I said in my previous post - the truth is, they're just jokes - like I agree - they should learn to be sensitive of Arts students and not throw around jokes, but conversely, we should also understand that they are merely ignorant due to the environment which they have been brought up in and their own distorted view of a degree.

[nacho]

As someone who intends to do a Diploma in Arts next year, I think the jokes are somewhat justified because most people don't actually know what you end up working in when you've finished an arts degree, it's just the fact that they're not familiar with the pathways an Arts degree can open up that leads them to bag it.

why'd this get so much hate?
I know it's not what paul said, because what he said was 'jokes are justified because people don't know anything about arts'
but it's pretty clear that he intended to say 'its not surprising people bag arts,  because they are ignorant of what arts entails so they bag it. people are on average ignorant of the arts degree. let us all be friends!'

im assuming butt-sensitive arts students + paul repped downvoted him.
goes a long way to show why people hate arts students

On the mention of being butt-hurt

A friend told me who's parents are doctors, and his mum is the head of a medical institute. Biomed kids become "lab factory workers" after 3 years and their income are not significantly higher than a "teacher" in school.

Ohh, did I forget to mention, Biomed's at Melb Uni is 99 whilst an Arts is a trifle atar?

And while I'm releasing my Artsy frustration to the rest of the world... FUCK YOU FOR BAGGING ARTS KIDS.

I would like to paraphrase from Lot's Wife by Monash "Arts kids get more social life, has more freedom compared to other subjects, gets the girls and has more uniting of the two opposite parties....Did I mention, the uniting of the two opposite parties? "


Yurrr Buddies. wHo LaUgHing NoW?


End Artsy Frustration.


After 6 months of being bagged

i never bagged arts students, i just pointed out that there are 'butt sensitive arts students' that neg repped paul.
and i implied it is their butt-sensitivity that fuels the jokes.

it hurts to continue on, cause i like patting ur hair?
Have i lost these privileges? I hope not, u have nice hair water u really do.

Why are u bagging biomed kids now? what difference is there between you, and the ones who make jokes on arts students? I guess for one, you went up to dig statistics and share personal anecdotes to reveal the sad futures of biomed kids, then u brought income into it..
why should a degree be valued on the income it brings?

ps: plz let me still pat u

[paulsterio]

Why must a comparison between degrees even be made - that's how arts jokes started off, by comparing - why must we continue that trend now?

[nacho]

Why must a comparison between degrees even be made - that's how arts jokes started off, by comparing - why must we continue that trend now?

paul the atarnotes white knight

brings a tear to my eye every damn time

[MJRomeo81]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2TbQrkk-wk

[JellyDonut]

as a student of hamburger university, i'd appreciate it if you stopped mocking my dream job

[kamil9876]

People who do Arts degrees in Australia need a thick skin. We all know the jokes about how having one means looking forward to a career in McDonalds, but when did they start? Why did it become so unfashionable, and even considered indulgent, to spend three years learning for learning’s sake.

I have to question whether the learning is productive thought; I live with two arts students who study poetry, and as far as I can tell,
learning is just writing down random shit on a piece of paper every 4 weeks. 

That sounds exactly like my approach to Arun's Assignments.

[slothpomba]

I have to question whether the learning is productive thought; I live with two arts students who study poetry, and as far as I can tell,
learning is just writing down random shit on a piece of paper every 4 weeks.

Uni is a lot more than "Person In - > Job Out". It's not just a job factory or a place to equip you with trade skills just for a particular job, if you want that and if you don't want to (arguably) think (broadly) at all, then a TAFE might be more your thing. We have this perception in Australia that uni's are just job factories and thats all. They're clearly not, people often say that you don't use 95% of what you learn in your uni degree in the "real world" like learning it in the first place was a bad thing.

Creativity is extremely important, broad knowledge is very important. Knowing technical skills with only get you so far, you'll only be able to produce and excel so much. It's only once with creativity and innovation that we see massive gains in productivity and fundamental shifts in society. It's that kind of broad knowledge and 'useless' learning that'll get you there 99% of the time (not specifically to arts but all fields).

Think about it, in science, if you just know how to mix and prepare samples, just all the really practical stuff, you're a lab technician/monkey. If you have broad knowledge and all the things that come with that you're a fully fledged scientist/researcher/whatever and most definitely not a drone. Just in terms of looking at it through an economic perspective, with things like innovation and productivity, this is clearly a good thing.

Theres nothing dirty about learning just for the sake of increasing your own knowledge, anyway, in the process you usually pick up skills of some kind or come out of it with a better informed world view. Remember, at tertiary level, you become a semi-expert in your field, you become part of the intelligentsia. If no one learns history, what happens to our knowledge of it? We're partially the custodians of knowledge at this point as well. A better educated population (yes, even in something like arts) is usually a more productive population on the whole and a more informed population (look at some of the average voters out there, imagine what help an education would be in a lot of cases).

A long time ago, we might of been having the same debate about how finishing high-school was useless. Indeed, up until fairly recently, a fairly huge proportion of people didn't even get that far. We're obviously better off for having more high-school graduates though, just in the same way we'll be better off as a society for having more university graduates.

[I'll just leave this here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57vCBMqnC1Y ]

[enwiabe]

For those of you who still can't grasp it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNK431VGPlE&feature=youtube_gdata

[ShortBlackChick]

I know it's an issue, but also note that I'm by no means anti-arts, I believe that it's a great degree with many majors which I find interesting, but I still don't think that it's right just to jump on anyone who throws around arts jokes, like I said in my previous post - the truth is, they're just jokes - like I agree - they should learn to be sensitive of Arts students and not throw around jokes, but conversely, we should also understand that they are merely ignorant due to the environment which they have been brought up in and their own distorted view of a degree.

LOL

Paul to Kazdawg after seeing her with a Sociology textbook inside Clayton Campus centre (very loudly might i add): 'Oh, whats this a text book? WHAT? Since when do arts students have text books?'

Paul to Kazdawg at MUSLCC BBQ after Kazdawg notes curry girls are looking at her for talking to Paul (my reputation is ruined): 'They're probably just wondering what a Med student like me is doing with an Arts student'

And the best of them all (paraphrased,) when Kazdawg's makes a facebook status about a curry aunty snobbing her off when Kazdawg tells her she's doing arts, Paul says: 'why dont you tell her you're doing arts/commerce not just arts?' (Granted Kazdawg does want to transfer into arts/commerce, granted random people told Paul to fuck off in aforementioned status)

There's a line between making jokes and being degrading based on ones shallow view.

[Phy124]

Now now, let's not turn this into a everyone against paul thread.

We can always start a new thread for that (Jokes)

I think we just have to face that there will always be hostilities between people doing different degrees and following alternate educational pathways, due to differing insecurities, regarding such things as ego and self-satisfaction, among others 

[paulsterio]

HEY KAZ YOU'RE JUST MEAN!

I swear, before I said "They're probably just wondering what a Med student like me is doing with an Arts student" - I said that I had a joke to crack and that it would be mean, and you said go ahead, so heeeeeey - be fair! and it was only in response to what you said to me

*glare*

[Mao]

I'd love to see a science major try to HD 4 foreign languages at once (which an incredibly talented friend of mine somehow manages) or attempt to unravel the dense political theories or philosophical works that arts students do every day.

I'm sorry, would you like to try my day job as a break from your dense work?

Jokes aside,

The idea that for a degree to be worthwhile it must lead to a "clear cut" profession is laughable (which NO degree does, by the way - yet another bit of narrow-minded stupidity from students who've been at uni for 3 months and think they know everything about education).

Some degrees do lead to a clear cut profession. Such as B.Teaching, B.Nursing, B.Engineering, MBBS, B.PharmSci., etc. I know very little about law, but I'm sure most people in LLB have a pretty clear career direction (at least, an immediate direction for the next 5~10 years). Similar goes for BComm. and BBus., though they are a bit broader. The same can't be said for BSc. and BA.

Disregarding the fact that an arts degree in fact leads to many careers (including Prime Minister of Australia, might I add), why does career determine the value of a degree?

It's a difference in the way of life, right? Some people choose to learn first, then apply what they know. Some people choose their career first, then learn what they need. If someone opts for the second path, then the career aspect of the degree is extremely important.

I'm not sure how accurate this is: http://sydney.edu.au/careers/career_advice/career_options/arts.shtml (Most likely to be very inaccurate), but it seems like the job market for specialists in Arts is quite small, the job market for "benefits from Arts" generally require further training (such as a Masters of something), and the alternative is the general non-specialist job market (which anyone can compete for).

How does this assessment compare to your idea of career paths for BA graduates?

And more importantly, if it is learning for the sake of learning, is the piece of paper important at all?

[SDPHD]

If anyone is letting any of this get to them (*cough* ninwa *cough*), then you're taking life way too seriously.

People make fun of things all the time. If they didn't, how fuckin' boring would life be?

If you have sound reasoning to 'make fun' of something, then you're not making fun of it at all, you're just stating facts and that's no fun.

I make fun of Arts students - they don't care. I make fun of Commerce students - they don't understand what I say (lawl internationals). People make fun of me - I don't care.

Just because I make fun of Arts students, it doesn't mean I feel that what I'm doing is superior compared to what they're doing, it doesn't mean I'm being ignorant and it doesn't mean I'm insecure with what I'm doing with my life. It just means I'm bored and I want to make myself chuckle because I'm just so damn hilarious.

I did a History and Philosophy subject as my breadth and it was probably the hardest thing I've had to do this semester. I have a lot more respect for people who can do well in a subject like that as opposed to those like me who just plug numbers into equations all day long.

I can't imagine doing another Arts subject again - it requires way too much brain power. I look at students who've been doing them for 3+ years and I wonder "Is a McValue meal really better value?" how they do it.

If you're happy doing what you're doing, then why the fuck should it matter what other people think?