(URGENT) I don't know what to do anymore!

[DetteAmelie]

Chill the fuck out academy girl! lol

What the hell is your problem? Give the OP a break, he/she had genuinely thought that pi's remarks were directed specifically at him/her. You don't have to be so rude. Learn some manners before you go around saying that to people, let alone someone you don't even know.

[nerdgasm]

Hey everyone, this is a relatively long post and I'm sorry if it bores the living daylights out of you (but I'm also assuming that if you've seen some of my previous posts, you'll know brevity is a rather difficult thing for me ). Most of my paragraphs really say the same thing and overlap heavily, so if you want to, just feel free to skim through.
This is a topic that I've personally thought about a bit (more so while in high school than university, but meh) , and I'd just like to add my opinions to those already present.

From the 'outside' point of view

I think in general, when someone tends to do well at something, particularly when this achievement is repeated, we tend to come to the conclusion that these achievements are not just by 'chance' or 'luck'. Part of this may be because we'd like to believe that the world is 'fair', and those who are the most deserving or work the hardest should do the most well; part of this may be due to the intuitive statistical reasoning in our minds: suppose a person gets 85% on a difficult test. Either it is a fluke, or they genuinely possess the skills and reasoning that would be expected of a person who could have gotten 85%. But if it keeps happening again and again, we reason that the chance of a '60% student' constantly getting 85% is low, and hence come to the conclusion that this student is not getting the high marks by chance.

And because we've come to the conclusion that the student is not getting the high marks by chance, it follows on from this that on the next test, we expect whatever characteristics they possess that allow them to do well on tests (whether they work extremely hard, are a born genius, are excellent at picking the sorts of questions that will be on the test, thrive under high-pressure situations, or something completely different), will again be demonstrated. In short, we expect them to do well again.

So, when such a person feels nervous and says they might not do well on the test, we reason (from a limited knowledge base; after all, we do not follow this person 24/7, observing their daily life and test preparation, and if we did, that'd be downright creepy) that given their preparation is likely to be the same as in previous tests, their results are likely to be the same. In fact, I think we also factor in the person's previous statements into this: if they have said they are not going to do well, but end up doing so on multiple occasions, we just place their self-doubting statements into "things they do before they do well on tests".

So, looking at it from this point of view, I personally believe it's fairly natural to expect the typical 'high-achievers' to do well on average, and that any 'blips' or 'outliers' they have in terms of score are just that: blips and outliers. With this in mind, whenever someone close to me says that they're not expecting to do as well as they normally do (I'm not saying anyone should do this or trying to impose my advice on others), usually the first thing I ask them is why they think this. What is different about this time, as compared to all the other times? Sometimes, I get the response that they feel they've just been 'lucky' all the previous times. Other times, they may state that they do not understand a particular concept well, that they haven't done as many practice tests, or they just keep making silly errors in their work.

These are all legitimate reasons why someone might not do as well as in the past. The point I'm trying to raise here is that really, the only defensible reason we have to doubt these reasons is if the person has made these points in the past, and still gone on to do well. Otherwise, only they know how much of a struggle learning things has been for them. Only they know how much work they've put in. I think it's important to trust these people on what they say regarding themselves. If not, then you've come (rightly or wrongly) to the decision that they're the sort of person who deliberately says they're going to do badly just to win sympathy and make everyone else feel worse. If so, then it's your choice on how you wish to deal with this.

From the 'inside' point of view

However, I'd now like to look at the other side of the coin. It's probably the side I'm more familiar with, having been looked up to and being somewhat confused by it, as well as being regarded as a typical 'high-achiever' throughout a fair portion of my school life.

I think there are several factors that contribute into what others may see as an 'irrational' fear of getting low marks on a particular test. One is that we tend to focus most of our attention on things we do not know, compared to things we know well. I'm sure we can all agree that using this strategy when revising is simply a good way to maximise gain for our efforts. However, when we worry, I'm sure that we tend to worry more on things we don't know well either. If you've ever wished that the essay or long-response question on an exam was based on a topic you know well, as opposed to something you may not know as well, you'll know what I mean.

Even if we know 90% of the course really well, and the other 10% of the course 'only' moderately well, I think certain people can still fear that the 10% they do not know in as much detail will be disproportionately tested on in the exam, leading to two things: being deprived of the chance to demonstrate the content they learnt, and obtaining quite a low score compared to their other results. I think that sometimes, we'd prefer 5 scores of 80%, rather than 4 scores of 85% and one 60%. So, I think that contributes to a high-achiever's fear of not knowing any part of the course/unit in great detail. You might make the argument that that's just the way the cookie crumbles, that there isn't enough time on an exam to cover every part of the course, and that average scores are generally used when looking at people's results anyway. It's a fair and logical argument, but it honestly doesn't stop people from feeling bad about getting a sub-average result. I also think it's linked to the point I make in my next paragraph.

I'd like to point out something I've definitely seen in myself and others: I don't like to get low scores, no matter how hard the exam is. Sometimes, I can say to myself, "Yeah, I had absolutely no hope of ever answering that question" and move on from it. More often that not, however, I'll kick myself for not seeing the method or trick to solve a particular question, even if it was 'unfair' or extremely difficult to see. I think it comes from the thought that, "Theoretically, myself on my best day could do it. So I could have done it. Why didn't I do it here?.

Another thing that I think sometimes high-achievers tend to lose focus of is that most tests aren't specifically written for them. I'm sure at some point in our educational journey, we've been told something along the lines of "Now, 60% of the test are your stock-standard questions, to determine whether you've learnt the very basics. These separate the passes from the fails. 30% are more challenging, these are used to separate you guys out into A's, B's C's etc. But the last 10% are there to challenge the best students, these are there to test those who sought to learn the content in greatest detail." I think sometimes, again we disproportionately assume the test will be full of the last kind of question, the most difficult.

To give an example of this, I knew practically nothing about the second half of my Linear Algebra course the day before the exam. I crammed the fundamentals of the subject into my head the night before the exam. Had I been tested on any of the proofs, or asked to give justifications for the methods I had rote-learned, I would not have been able to. I was very anxious that precisely this would happen; it did not. Instead, the questions mostly focused on the rote-learned methods, with the more difficult questions based on simpler applications, which I could do.

Now, it's all well and good for me to write a verbose expository essay about this, but what can people on both sides of the coin actually do?

I think the approaches described by some of the previous posts in this thread are quite good ones. I can definitely say from my own experience that having a group of friends who don't really pressure anyone into talking about marks or exam questions is a great way to relieve a lot of potential stress. Also, if someone asks me how a test or SAC is, usually I try to avoid saying things like "It was easy" or "It was hard", but instead, I try to give more 'objective' statements, like "Most of the questions are fairly similar to the ones in the textbook", or "Really read the questions carefully, know your definitions well", or "There were some tricky questions on <subject X>, but I think the rest was about the same as the tute questions". In all of these cases, it's really up to the person whether the information I give them makes them feel more or less secure. Of course, I'd prefer it if what I said makes them more relaxed, but it's not always going to be the case.

I agree that it's also good to appreciate that different people will have different expectations on their results. Ultimately, unless you're incredibly gifted and work yourself to the bone, it's almost guaranteed that there will be people who will be able to do less work than you, and still achieve better results. So, these people are probably aware of their own capabilities, and again, compare themselves to their most talented possible self.Now, it's never easy to feel like you're working so hard, and somebody else does half the work and gets better results. But I think it's important to appreciate that it's not easy on the person who got the better results either. Whenever somebody who has worked harder than me, but has not done as well as I have asks me for my results, I always feel guilty about it. I start thinking about what they're going to say, and how I can respond to it in a way that doesn't make them feel bad. What can I possibly say? I honestly have never worked this out. However, I'd still make the point that having higher expectations than others is not a bad thing in and of itself.

Finally, I'd like to address the topic of being competitive in terms of knowing other people's marks. I went through a period in Year 8 where myself and one of my friends would compare marks with each other after every single piece of assessment. I did this because I saw the other guy as a genius whom I had to beat, in order to prove my own worth and intelligence. Looking back on it now, I don't really like the person I was back then. I also once knew a guy in Year 12 who was adamant in knowing everyone else's marks (heck, he even once looked at the teacher's private book when the teacher wasn't looking, just to find out everyone's marks). He was a good person in practically all other respects. I think in both these cases, we were all just somewhat insecure, and wanted to make sure that we were still 'good enough'. I personally admit that there have been times when I've overstepped the line and 'fished' for compliments, and I'm thankful that my friends have always told me when this has occurred.

However, I think that being competitive for marks can be based upon 'better' reasons. Sometimes, I look up to a person because they just seem to understand the material that I enjoy so well. It's because I have a passion for the material that I wish I could understand it as well as I do, because I know it would bring me a lot of enjoyment if I could. Now, you might ask me, "why that person's marks? Why not just seek to do as well as you can, and you'll enjoy it?". The thing is, that person's marks have now become a benchmark by which I can measure my level of understanding and hence enjoyment. Not doing as well as them means there are things that I do not understand, but really wish I could. The other person's general level of understanding is what I strive for; the marks are just an indicator of that. It's honestly just sometimes easier to set a goal around a concrete mark.

Anyways, I hope that this post has helped with understanding where people from both sides of the argument are coming from. Ultimately, I believe that you have the absolute right to disclose your scores to whoever you choose, and no-one else. Anyone who disagrees with that is being very insensitive, in my opinion. While it can be annoying to see people constantly complain that they're not going to do well, and then pull off spectacular results, I think it's important to understand that for them, the stress may very well be real, and if so, it's more important to deal with the causes of that than criticise them for it. On the other hand, I think it's also important to be mindful of the effort other people have put in to whatever work they do, and to demonstrate tact in dealing with these kinds of situations.



 

[Stick]

Hey, I've been pondering this thread for a couple of days now and I thought I could help people in a similar boat to the OP and myself by providing some tips and tricks that I know have worked. It's funny actually, because this thread could not have come at a better time for me personally, because I was going through a bit of a rough patch myself, until recently. I hope you find these helpful.

Tip #1: Admit to yourself that you have this issue.

You have to accept that sometimes, when things are tough, you'll just be a rotten person to be around. You're going to have your good days and your not so good days. This is part of your life and it's something that you mustn't fight with, but learn to effectively manage. As terrible as you may be, you need to also realise that sometimes it's something you just can't help and you can't always be so hard on yourself and blame yourself for everything. It's easy to make yourself feel guilty during these times, but this isn't beneficial for anyone involved.

Tip #2: Accept that you're going to make mistakes, no matter how hard you try.

This is part of who you are and chances are that this will only go away over an extended period of time. In the mean time, it's all about management. If you're with the right crowd, people will understand and everything will be OK.

Tip #3: Be upfront about your issue.

This is really important for those commencing university next year, particularly those who want a fresh start. As you start to meet new people and make new friends, you need to be honest about things. Perhaps after a few conversations, you could say something along the lines of:

"Hey, I just want you to know that I'm not always the easiest person to deal with, especially in stressful times. I have a couple of anxiety conditions and while I don't mean it, I probably will annoy you when I'm not in a good place. If we're going to be friends, I need you to be aware of what you might be dealing with in the future."

Be clear and to the point. If they distance themselves after you've opened up to them, then you've averted a crisis later by hanging out with the wrong person. You need to be careful in deciding you you want to be closer with. This is a good way of finding the right people for you.

In addition, you're doing everything in your power to do things right by the other person, particularly given the fact that you might unintentionally not be a good person to deal with on a particular day. They will come to understand that the problem isn't actually you or your personality, but will realise that it's a part of you that you can't always control.

Tip #4: Come to terms with the fact that some people won't accept you.

Not everyone will care or understand, and some just won't put themselves in a potentially negative environment. Others will take it out directly on you. This is understandable. People need to preserve their own sanity too. Hopefully though you won't have to deal with this too much, particularly if you follow tip #3.

Tip #5: Take the time to reflect.

One of our biggest issues, as terrible and unpleasant as it may be, is that we have trouble getting beyond our own full on headspace and empathising with others' feelings. This is easier if you actually find a quiet moment and actually take the time to reflect on the day's occurrences. You'll find it much easier to develop an awareness for how others are feeling. If you think that perhaps you weren't too good the other day, you can apologise to those affected later on. Something like this might be good to say:

"Hey, I just wanted to apologise for my behaviour the other day. I know I wasn't too pleasant to be around and I wasn't really thinking about how you'd be feeling. I hope you'll understand that I didn't mean it."

This will be accepted if you've followed the above tips and tried to do everything else right by them. You can't always control your actions on a bad day, but you can definitely take adequate responsibility for them in better times.

Tip #6: Find one person who you can confide in about everything.

Sometimes you'll feel the whole world is against you and you'll be really upset and angry. You need to talk about your feelings with someone you can trust. Preferably, this person should be able to see things from both 'sides'. If you tell someone that cannot see it from your side, they will misinterpret your thoughts and you'll probably get a hard time and criticism for who you are, which is definitely not conductive to working through difficult times. On the other hand, you need someone who can at least see that outside perspective and help you to understand the impact of your words and actions on others. At the same time, they should be able to understand you. Communication is so important, and perhaps things often don't go that well because people make assumptions and base their interpretations solely on the facts available to them.

Make sure you find other ways to collect your thoughts too. There are a lot of hobbies or activities that might facilitate this in some way.



I know I sound like some expert on this, but believe me, I still make shocking mistakes and have shocking days. There's more than enough evidence of it on this very forum. Lastly, if anyone wants to have a deeper chat about this, I would be more than happy for you to shoot me through a PM. All the best.