I raised objections on the moderator forums and I was asked to post them here (and I'll take this opportunity to remind people that Nina has made it up for debate, as per the first lines of her vote. AN has always welcome contributions regarding the running of the site). Looking at the upvotes of Nina's post, it seems people tend to agree, but this is a modified version of my argument against it. I have really only removed things that are inappropriate for wider reading. The way I've written this post was a bit ranty, and it's not as well-written as it normally would be if I were mounting a serious argument. Nina just asked me why I disagreed and this was essentially my reply:
1. Inappropriate topicsSpoiler
The board was initially intended to be for mental health issues/awareness only. I changed it to "general support" after receiving some legal advice to that effect.
This meant that we (moderation team) were stuck between a rock (making subjective judgment calls about what is "appropriate") and a hard place (letting more lighthearted topics like partying/drinking etc. drown out the more serious threads about depression, suicidal thoughts etc.).
This is a nothing point. This is similar to saying that we should scrap welfare payments because some people use it inappropriately. They take drugs, or quit their jobs just to get payments, blah blah blah, but there are still legitimate people in requirement of welfare payments. I fail to see the point in this at all - is this reason powerful because us poor mods are stuck with difficult decisions, which really are pretty trivial? Drowning out more serious threads - fair enough - but the threads are still there, and people can still talk to people anonymously about serious issues. Moreover, "threads are inappropriate so we should remove the anon boards" is a big jump in logic from "threads are inappropriate and this could be bad so maybe we should find a way to nullify inappropriate threads?". I don't see how it would be complex for us to introduce some standards into the boards without it rendering us legally viable. Moreover, I don't see that much of an issue with our current standard of "let everything be there". So what if people want to ask about their tax file number? So what if people are asking about schoolwork? And then the occasional "how do I bake a cake?" thread, which is probably a result of having HELP in the title and people thinking "oh yeah I need help with my cake". So yeah anyway, I think this point is not great.
2. Unqualified advice is dangerous, especially in relation to mental healthSpoiler
Recent events have made it clear that having people with no mental health qualifications respond to people who are depressed and potentially suicidal is dangerous. In particular (and I didn't want to point fingers, but I'm still pissed off about this), the recent thread posted by someone who said they were suicidal and which received two incredibly rude and vitriolic replies, which resulted in the OP deleting their blog.
It was irresponsible of me to have let it happen in the first place. I have realised that I cannot guarantee that the board will remain a safe and supportive environment where people can air serious personal problems anonymously and without fear of ridicule. And without that guarantee, I honestly don't see the point of maintaining the board.
Spoiler
This is the only decent point here. Firstly, the idea that because people are unqualified, they're accidentally going to say things in a genuine attempt to help and have it turn out horrible is silly. If anyone could please explain to me exactly how the posts in the most recent thread were a GENUINE attempt to help, I would appreciate that. Not having mental health qualifications doesn't mean you can't help people. This point has been raised and I would like for anyone to elaborate on how "nice/supportive" doesn't translate to help in a mental health scenario? Why are people who have a support network at far less risk of depression/anxiety? Are we saying this correlation is totally void? Because I can't think of any one of my friends who has a support network full of only qualified psychologists. In fact, I can think of very many friends who have support networks made up of totally unqualified people. I've talked a friend down from killing themselves. They didn't say "your advice is unqualified I'm doing it anyway". They said "shit, thanks for being there" and I said "go see a doctor" and that's what they did. There is a difference between having poor mental health and having a psychiatric problem. The people with poor mental health - that's what they need - NICENESS AND SUPPORT! How many people have posted shit up that just need someone to talk to, so they come to AN and have people empathise with them? We don't need to fix people's problems, we need to give them at outlet to bitch about their parents and have other people be like "ah yeah, fucking sucks, mine are the same". Even for more serious issues - I've had at least three people that I can think of off the top of my head message me about long-term and significant problems, then message me later saying "thanks heaps, doing so much better, that helped me get back on track". What's wrong with empathising with people then encouraging them to see a psychologist? In many, many scenarios on the health board, that's what's been done.
It's only dangerous because of people aforementioned - who were not genuinely trying to help, who were using an anonymous opportunity to be snarky - made a bad decision. Ban them from the anon boards. Establish some rules for that forum. VERY RARELY on the math boards or Vic Ed boards, do we get people saying "nah you can't get an ATAR of 70, you're a fucking idiot". If ever. Any forum could be dangerous. Obviously less so than this one, but the point being is - almost never (if not never), do we have deliberate attempts at making people feel bad. The only totally unhelpful, ridiculous replies are the ones like mine in the party thread. Other than this incident, when's the last time someone was stupid enough to go onto a suicidal person's thread and be silly about it? I think this is less of a huge issue. Cutting the boards because of this incident is knee-jerk and not well considered. We will never be able to fully guarantee anything. Why let your mother outside? No guarantee she won't be hit by a car, or stabbed by a robber. I'm not brushing aside what's happened. I seem facetious, but I'm just making the point that "not being able to guarantee" does not mean "will happen often" or even "has happened before this". If you literally wanted to guarantee it, you could make all posts in the anon forum subject to approval by moderators, the same as the tutoring ads. Better alternative than scrapping it. The obvious reaction to this is "too much work". However, if there was an "approve all" message for all replies people have made, we'd only have to read them and click that button. Rarely, if ever, would we have to do anything else. The next objection would be similar to the first point in Nina's "Reasons" thread - subjective judgment calls. Well, there's a difference between something being not that helpful and something needing to be removed. I'm sure "Don't let threads in where people are saying things similar to: get over it, you're silly, you're [insult]" etc etc etc would be a sufficient standard for us.
1. Poor mental health and psychological issues are two different domains. Majority of things in that board come under the former category. Niceness and support is sufficient help for stressed people or people that don't have serious psychological issues. Even if it isn't sufficient, that doesn't mean it shouldn't be there anyway.
2. The people with serious psychological issues, at the very worst case scenario we could listen empathetically (google empathetic listening Here you go: http://www.beyondintractability.org/essay/empathic-listening) and then urge them to see a doctor. Are we not qualified to say "That's so harsh, I really feel for you. It's so great you're ready to seek help, but I think it's time to seek it from someone more qualified". It's not hard. I'll write you twenty templates and people can fill in the blanks. "It's so harsh [that your mum is a bitch]. [I really feel for you, it sucks that [you've had to deal with anxiety for five years]. etc etc...3. Supporting mental health issues is out of our domainSpoiler
AN is an education service. We are not qualified to provide help on serious issues like mental illness. It was an "ambitious" (read: idiotic) experiment on my part, and I have to concede that it has failed.
See above.
Also, one person taking advantage of their anonymous status does not make a failure. The threads have been removed already, otherwise I would simply bombard this reply with links to "successes".
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