American presidential election

[jamonwindeyer]

Why does everyone seem so upset.

I would've preferred Hilary too just because of what kind of person trump is but either way US was fucked.

A man accused of sexual assault, who made racism a part of his political platform, is the most politically influential person in the Western World ... I think that's all the reason we need....

Compared to (at worst) some objectionable policies from Clinton, which is always the case. In my opinion, there is literally no comparison between the damage a politician like Clinton COULD do, and what the divisiveness that Trump promotes WILL do.

All we can hope is that the checks and balances system in the US encourages him to retreat from his aggressive campaign policies.

[Cornrow Kenny]

I haven't been keeping up with the election a great deal bar today nor have I read through all of this thread but I am a fan of Trump's plan to build a barrier on the Mexican border.

[vox nihili]

I haven't been keeping up with the election a great deal bar today nor have I read through all of this thread but I am a fan of Trump's plan to build a barrier on the Mexican border.

[geminii]

People weren't voting for who they wanted - they were voting against who they didn't want. Either way, America would lose. Although at the start I would have preferred Hilary to win, today I hoped Donald would win.

I understand why a lot of people don't like Donald but you have to realise that at least, unlike Hillary, Donald speaks the truth, and that he can actually take some action and make America better. Hillary consistently lies, even laughing at women her husband raped (while there are only allegations that Trump raped people - and isn't it convenient that all these women are coming out now?) I'm not saying Trump didn't rape people - he very well may have - but we don't know for a fact. But what we do know for a fact is that Hillary laughed at the women that Bill Clinton, her own husband, had hurt, and what does that say about her?
She put on a facade of kindness and caring for America - but we all know she lied about the emails. According to her, none of them were classified. But it was found that many of her emails actually contained classified information. Another lie was about how she stated that 95% of her emails were stored on the database, while in actuality, only about 5% were.
And the latest lie - Hillary said that she would support the outcome of the election, whether she won or Donald won. Well, look how that turned out - she didn't show up to meet her campaigners today and decided not to speak. What does that say about Hillary? Add another lie to the already long list! At least Donald Trump was frank and honest in saying that he may or may not accept the outcome. America needs an honest president.

I'm not saying I would have voted for Trump. If I was American I would have voted for a third party, Clifton Roberts. But what I am saying is that Trump is less worse than Hillary.

Of course everyone is open to have their own opinions! 

[Russ]

Her policy positions are largely agreeable too. She's for gun laws, pro-choice, in favour of same sex marriage. She's in favour of allowing illegal immigrants, who have lived in and contributed to the US for years, to stay. She's also pro-trade and respected by world leaders all around the world.

Her policy positions are agreeable to you. The American working class feel very differently and I think the most significant part of this result is just how badly they were underestimated. Clinton is as establishment as they get, up there with Bush and Kennedy and by all accounts the perception of an influential elite costing the average American their opportunities to succeed resonated with the country. Her campaign didn't really fight on that axis and it seems to have been a mistake (calling Trump supporters deplorable was monumentally stupid).

I also disagree that the email scandal was a non-issue, there was plenty of content that fed right into the above concerns about corruption and self-interest, from being given debate questions in advance to inappropriate use of money etc.

[geminii]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

I'm not saying Trump isn't bad! He's homophobic, racist, and wants to build a wall between America and Mexico. That's really horrible!

Ugh, if only they picked better candidates, America wouldn't be in this mess!

Her policy positions are agreeable to you. The American working class feel very differently and I think the most significant part of this result is just how badly they were underestimated. Clinton is as establishment as they get, up there with Bush and Kennedy and by all accounts the perception of an influential elite costing the average American their opportunities to succeed resonated with the country. Her campaign didn't really fight on that axis and it seems to have been a mistake (calling Trump supporters deplorable was monumentally stupid).

I also disagree that the email scandal was a non-issue, there was plenty of content that fed right into the above concerns about corruption and self-interest, from being given debate questions in advance to inappropriate use of money etc.

Agreed!

[The Usual Student]

Just thinking about kanye vs trump 2020........
holy crap that one will be a lively election.....

[jamonwindeyer]

Although I'm no supporter of Trump, whenever people bring up Trump's sexual assault allegations, I just think it reeks of hypocrisy- a 5 second google search of "Bill Clinton" highlights this reality...

Bill Clinton wasn't running for president?

[mahler004]

I've been watching this all day. I think I wrote on these forums in March or so that "Trump won't win the primary, and if he does, he'll get slaughtered by Clinton in the general." Yep. For better or worse, I was wrong.

I'm pretty shocked that the polls got it this wrong, frankly. The minute she had to wait to win Virginia (should have been an easy win), the fact that she's going to lose Florida and the entire Rust Belt, yeah. It's pretty incredible. Points to a major electoral realignment.

Either way, then sun will rise tomorrow morning (and on the morning of January 21, and every morning thereafter). Trump won't be a good President, but America is a strong country, and a strong republic. Saner minds will prevail. I hope.

Although I'm no supporter of Trump, whenever people bring up Trump's sexual assault allegations, I just think it reeks of hypocrisy- a 5 second google search of "Bill Clinton" highlights this reality...

For what it's worth, they're not allegations. He literally admitted to sexual assault.

Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton are also two different people.

[Cornrow Kenny]

Moral of the story - the public cannot be trusted. This is why we need dictatorships!

 

[Orb]

Bill Clinton wasn't running for president?

If you're married to someone who commits sexual assault, it really speaks quite a lot about yourself imo.

I still think Hillary was the better choice.

[Cornrow Kenny]

I'm pretty shocked that the polls got it this wrong, frankly. The minute she had to wait to win Virginia (should have been an easy win), the fact that she's going to lose Florida and the entire Rust Belt, yeah. It's pretty incredible. Points to a major electoral realignment.

There was, and still is, a stigma behind being a Trump supporter. Worsened by Clinton's extreme celebrity support, few would be open about being a Trump supporter in fear of being ridiculed or attacked. Predictions and polls did not and could not account for all the hidden Trump supporters who came out of the bushes to vote.

[mahler004]

There was, and still is, a stigma behind being a Trump supporter. Worsened by Clinton's extreme celebrity support, few would be open about being a Trump supporter in fear of being ridiculed or attacked. Predictions and polls did not and could not account for all the hidden Trump supporters who came out of the bushes to vote.

Yeah. It's pretty clear that pollsters just got their model of the electorate wrong. Whole thing points to very large white working class turnout. There was also a fairly large undecided vote, even in the last few days, which adds a fair degree of uncertainty. US pollsters generally have a pretty good record, but they got this one wrong by a pretty incredible margin, and I simply think it's because they got their electoral model wrong.

There's a couple of other things - there are vocal Trump supporters (the hat-wearing, #MAGA crowd) and I think people though that all Trump voters were like that. In the last few days, Republican holdouts seemed to have gone to Trump in the end (instead of staying home or voting for a third party.) These are people which didn't vote for Trump in the primary (and contributed to the large undecided vote) but are conservatives. They're not a natural Clinton constituency. Trump generally underperformed his polls in the primaries, and people thought he'd do so again here. Not the case.

In the end, it also appears that the so-called 'hidden Hispanic' vote didn't eventuate, or at least not to the levels that Clinton needed to flip states like Florida and Arizona.

In the end, the thing that flipped the election was conservatives coming home for Trump.

edit: I should say though, the 'conservatives are afraid to say they'll vote for conservatives in polls' isn't really all that well documented. There hasn't historically been a 'shy Tory' factor in US elections. Until now, at least.

[TheProphetPancake]

One things for sure though - great time to go and spend your hard-earned moolah in America
Last I checked, $1 USD= $1.30 AUD
Go now before the walls up! 

[Cornrow Kenny]

There's a couple of other things - there are vocal Trump supporters (the hat-wearing, #MAGA crowd) and I think people though that all Trump voters were like that. In the last few days, Republican holdouts seemed to have gone to Trump in the end (instead of staying home or voting for a third party.)

Hit the nail on the head.

In the end, it also appears that the so-called 'hidden Hispanic' vote didn't eventuate, or at least not to the levels that Clinton needed to flip states like Florida and Arizona.

Agreed.

There's one more controversial thing I wanna add before I go study. I've heard the "lesser of two evils" line or something similar numerous times a day for months now, and this is what I think threw a lot of people off (I thought Clinton would win too ftr). The Americans who were saying this online or in interviews, were often using it to explain their reasoning behind voting Clinton. Rarely (if ever) the other way around. To me that makes it obvious that Clinton is not a strong candidate in the eyes of many her "supporters" who may have not even voted, merely an anti-Trump. Many who voted for Clinton saw her as the only option, while others saw Trump as a viable candidate. 

Sorry if that was obvious but it was the last line that I needed to get off my chest 

edit: That could be entirely wrong but from what I have observed it often seems to be the case for reasoning as to why people support Hilary more so than Trump