James Lu should be happy he got 99.95 and stop dishing out on the VCE

[twoplustwoisfive]

addressing chairman mao's (is that deliberate? haha) reply chiastically
yes i agree.
the underlying logic of my proposed system is to shift focus from a percentile score derived from aggregate to avoid people 'exploiting' the system. this is only in reply to rather cynical comments purporting this.
in an ideal world there are many universities to choose from and a large enough student body to make those universities selective to varying degrees. students who are certain of what they want to do, take up subjects of that interest and fulfill all of the pre-requisites of a university course and are offered accelerated programs so that they finish their education sooner. those students who are uncertain, which would be most people i imagine, would take on a broader array of subjects and go into a uni program which is progressively more specific until they know what they want to do.
that is in my mind near ideal granted, it's so fictional it's almost tolkein.
re: scaling; isnt the competition within a cohort linked to the difficulty? i say difficulty not as in how hard the coursework is, but how hard it is to do well relative to others in that subject.
to the hypothetical situation: if the application system were more like the US, numerical scores would only be part of the process and so there would be more to differentiate students, such as personality, and what they can add to the community.
thank you for the acknowledgment.
re: eriny...didnt see your post for some reason...but read it now
indeed i am a bit of an idealist, but many universities in the US do look out for these things. if what you say is true, that is a very sad portraiture of reality...in australia at least.
imo the US system trumps ours.
on a completely irrelevant note. im thinking of going to anu but am a bit in the dark about their 'system' and process
kenhung123: how defeatist...in a few years no one will be doing vce cos of the naitonal curric. im skeptical about its effectiveness but it is a change

[Eriny]

I think the US system is good because there are so many more universities. They've got broad ones, but also a lot of niche places and admission is catered with that in mind. Australia doesn't have as many unis, and they don't tend to specialise, so admission is a bit of a conveyor belt. However, at least for undergrad, I do think that Australia is better because in the end, you come out with a very good education at a relatively low cost and you can go straight to a professional career after your first degree if that's what you want.

[xXNovaxX]

^ At Eriny (correct me if I am wrong/mis-understood)

In regards to Uni's becoming more fair etc; I think the system is good enough as it is >< that is, any extra tweaking to make it "fair" is just a bonus, and risks making University an institution which is a  "free ride/entry"....

For example, Commonwealth Supported Places are an IMMENSE help, and are available to almost every University student, instead of making like $14,000 you pay $4000 (if ur in band 1 aka medicine), to like $7000 (if ur doing Humanities), that is an extraordinary "cheap" price for University, if u compare it to how much full fee students pay, and international.

In addition the SEAS.....this has helped thousands of students who are 1-3 (%??) off the Clearly-IN ENTER, and most students fall under at least ONE of the 7 categories.

In addition, the University of Melbourne-highest ranked in Victoria, this year lowered the ENTER from 85 to 78 for Bachelor of Environments if you are a SEAS applicant, and will do it for Engineering next year? I think it was.

WOW.....that is a very large fall in ENTER, and the University risks having an influx of "non-highest scoring students", thus "tarnishing" its prestige....it's all in the aim of making it fairer (sure there may be greedy reasons to why they are dong it, but hey it helps us)

And in regards to specialisation, I know we are nowhere near America's standards in Uni, but what do you mean w=in regards to specialisation?

ANU= Politics, policy making
Monash=Engineering
Melbourne=Law
RMIT= Architecture

I could have mis-interpreted your points, but was just interested in what you were saying

 

[xXNovaxX]

Nova, which one is Med?
I'd put Melb as Med, having watched all their Biomedicine videos and what medical facilities they have!...

I am not too sure (hence I left it out ), because I get confused between biomedicine, pharmacy etc, but it's definitely either Monash or Melbourne, but like I said, I get confused between those two ><

[erghjjenrg]

James has a legitimate reason for his opinion which may i add is his PERSONAL opinion, this does not reflect how anyone should or shouldnt view VCE but only on what his thought was of it.
for anyone who does not agree with his opinion, it is not wise to be 'bitching' about someone else's opinions considering people may not agree to yours.
so if u do not personally know the guy and do not actually fully understand his concept on vce then you should just keep your opinion to yourself.

[schmalex]

I think that if you can't think up a better system, shut the fuck up and stop complaining.

[kyzoo]

^ People should complain if it's flawed even if they cannot conceive a solution, otherwise the authorities will assume the situation is satisfactory. Openly-expressed discontent is the step towards improvement.

[schmalex]

No it isn't, thinking of ways it could be improved is.

[*ryan777*]

sorry, i agree with kyzoo
the 1st step is complaining, only then can you actually work out what you need to change

[brightsky]

Yes, that is true. Without knowing what the flaws are in something, how are you to improve it. By finding out flaws in the systems means dictating out loud, i.e. 'complaining'.

[TrueLight]

its this thread tram

[zomgSEAN]

VCE = Showing how good you are at learning.

[vexx]

VCE = Showing how good you are at learning.

more like = showing how good you are at not making mistakes.

[Furbob]

VCE = Showing how good you are at learning.

more like = showing how good you are at not making mistakes.

+over-9000

[wildareal]

Entry via meaningless scores into a vocational vortex with only one destination: mediocrity. The golden line. Wow this post has come a long way. I really think James Lu has a point, and I wrote this comment as a response to his lofty article. For someone to come and say this with such a great score as he had is really admirable. I think the problem of VCE lies in the fact that there are too many subjects and thus the need for scaling-which is the most controversial aspect of the VCE. I think if we want to make a feasible education system, we need to make a generic one like the IB where all subjects are of equal difficulty. You may ask how we may cater for students wanting to do relatively easier subjects such as PE, SOSE etc-this could be solved by having a separate Diploma for the 'easier' subjects. Also the disparity that comes with scaling could definitely be solved by reducing the high scaling in languages, but not getting rid of it, as there still needs to be some means of encouraging people to pick up langauges such as Latin/Ancient Greek etc. That's my two cents.