Similarities between subjects in different states

[taiga]

I think it could be interesting to explore the similarities different subjects to equivalent studies in different states.

It could provide as an additional resource for students to be able to freely access papers made by the related authorities.

Anyone know of any similarities at this stage?

[Ghost!]

I think it could be interesting to explore the similarities different subjects to equivalent studies in different states.

It could provide as an additional resource for students to be able to freely access papers made by the related authorities.

Anyone know of any similarities at this stage?

Also interested!

[Lasercookie]

Comparing HSC Physics and VCE Physics

I'm only going to focus on the year 12 courses here. The idea of this is to give an overview of both courses.
Hopefully it will render resources from the other states usable, knowing where content overlaps etc. Most of the information is sourced from the study designs and textbooks.

HSC Resources:
NSW board of studies page: http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/syllabus_hsc/physics.html

VCE Resources:
VCAA page: http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/physics/physicsindex.html

Prerequisites:
HSC Physics seems to mandate the "preliminary" year 11 course.
VCE Physics 3/4 can be done without 1/2.

Level of mathematics used in both courses is similar.

Course Structure
HSC Physics is made up of 'core' studies and 'options'. VCE Physics also has mandatory area of studies, and options in the form of detailed studies.

Course Content
HSC Physics
HSC Core:
Space
    -   Covers motion, gravitation
    -   Very similar to VCE Physics Unit 3 Outcome 1.
    -   Also covers Special Relativity, this is almost identical to the VCE Physics detailed study in Unit 3
    -   Interesting that special relativity is not optional
Motors and Generators
    -   Very similar to VCE Physics Unit 4 Area of Study 1 – Electric Power
From Ideas to Implementation
    -   Covers cathode rays, photoelectric effect, black body radiation, transistors and super conductivity
    -   Cathode rays were covered in Unit 1&2 VCE Physics (Medical Physics detailed study)
    -   Transistors is covered in VCE Physics Unit 3 Further Electronics detailed study
    -   Photoelectric effect is covered in VCE Physics Unit 4 Area of Study 2 – Interactions of Light and Matter
   
Options:
Geophysics
    -
Medical Physics
    -   Covered in Unit 1&2 Physics (Detailed study)
   
Astrophysics
    -   Somewhat covered in Unit 1&2 Physics (detailed study)
   
From Quanta to Quarks
    -   Some content in this option is covered in Unit 4 VCE Physics Area of Study 2 – Interactions of Light and Matter
    -   Appears to be a lot more interesting than L&M, as it doesn't stop at de Broglie. However the later content in this chapter   
        is radioactivity stuff - covered in Unit 1.
    -   The different atomic models (Thomson, Rutherford, Bohr etc.)
    -   Niels Bohr, Atomic Emission and Absorption spectra
    -   "Bohr's Postulates" (never heard them called that before - but I guess they are, 1. electrons exist in stationary state etc.)
    -   Hydrogen atom - limitations of Bohr's model
    -   de Broglie! (one of the great moustachesminds in Physics)
    -   The Neutron
    -   Fermi Chain Reaction, other nuclear stuff
    -   Particle accelerators - Covered in Unit 4 Synchrotron detailed study (much less depth here).
    -   This is no longer examinable, but the idea of string theory was introduced (only as an idea).
The Age of Sillicon
   -

Examinations
HSC has 1 end of year exam that covers the entire year. It runs for 3 hours.
VCE has 1 midyear exam covering Unit 3 and 1 end of year exam covering Unit 4. They both run for 1 hour 30 minutes.

Both exams provide a formulae sheet. HSC exam includes a periodic table. I couldn't find anything about a cheat sheet/reference sheet for the HSC exam.

HSC Past Exams:
http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/hsc_exams/hsc2010exams/
http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/hsc_exams/papers.html

Calculator requirements are the same. HSC has a list of approved scientific calculators (http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/hsc_exams/calculators.html)

Conclusion
HSC exams mainly contain questions that would be covered in Unit 3 Physics, as the majority of it is motion, special relativity and further electronics type stuff. It probably wouldn't be worth trying to use a HSC past exam for VCE Physics. The problems set out are too similar - if HSC Physics happened to be leagues better than VCE Physics (i.e. provided better problems) than it'd be worth the time and effort. At this stage, a standard university textbook would be a good source of what I classify as 'interesting problems'. While content is similar, the course structures are too different to utilise a HSC exam for exam practice. You'd be better off just using the trial exams already available for VCE (neap etc.).

The HSC textbooks are also extremely similar to the VCE textbooks. I noticed chunks of text reused between both. There wouldn't be much point in using a HSC textbook in order to expand your knowledge a bit more. I didn't really take a look at the textbook questions carefully, but they were of a similar quality level (i.e. not that good).

[pi]

Nice work laseredd! Looks like HSC physics has more real physics!

[Lasercookie]

Nice work laseredd! Looks like HSC physics has more real physics!

I was disappointed to learn that HSC Physics doesn't utilise calculus, despite what I had heard before (don't remember where though).
It's pretty awesome that everyone does special relativity, doing the SR detailed study in Unit 3 was awesome. Overall, the content covered is quite similar, but the way the exams are written are quite different. It'd almost be a waste of time to try and use the HSC past exams to study for VCE physics. You might as well do first year physics problem sets (which I wish I had done for motion, much more interesting questions).

The HSC board of studies did have this cool practice test generator on their website though: http://www4.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/course/higher-school-certificate/physics/

I've got a couple of SACs this week, so hopefully I'll be able to get around to finishing more of that post on the weekend.

[ohexploitable]

I posted this elsewhere but thought it might fit here as well.

VCE Specialist Mathematics vs. NSW Mathematics Extension 2.

m8

After having a look at some of your past exams, to be honest, they're not even half the difficulty of ours. Our exams are structured with 8 questions, each increasing in difficulty, your exams are up to question 3 in ours. Also, you seem to only cover half of the topics we do (and the easier ones too).

On top of that you're given a rather comprehensive formula sheet, have multiple choice and are allowed graphing calculators.

Try this: http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/hsc_exams/hsc2010exams/pdf_doc/2010-hsc-exam-mathematics-extension-2.pdf

Go straight to Question 8 lol.

[appianway]

Nice work laseredd! Looks like HSC physics has more real physics!

Actually, the general consensus is everything to the contrary... VCE science is regarded as more rigorous, but VCE math is pretty much a joke.

[pi]

Nice work laseredd! Looks like HSC physics has more real physics!

Actually, the general consensus is everything to the contrary... VCE science is regarded as more rigorous, but VCE math is pretty much a joke.

Really? I know our maths is of a low standard, but I fail to see the physics in VCE physics... We are simply given a bunch of formulas and constants and then are expected to calc-bash the answers. There is the occasional theory question, but then again, there is a cheat-sheet...

[Lasercookie]

Nice work laseredd! Looks like HSC physics has more real physics!

Actually, the general consensus is everything to the contrary... VCE science is regarded as more rigorous, but VCE math is pretty much a joke.

Really? I know our maths is of a low standard, but I fail to see the physics in VCE physics... We are simply given a bunch of formulas and constants and then are expected to calc-bash the answers. There is the occasional theory question, but then again, there is a cheat-sheet...

Looking at the HSC Physics exams, it seems to also have it's fair share of "calc-bashing".

Maybe appianway was talking about the content covered? This is biased, but I reckon our course outline VCE Physics is probably done a bit better than the HSC Physics (minus the special relativity being optional in VCE - everyone should have that privilege, it also seems to be a natural expansion on all the motion stuff we do). I think the HSC course is weakened a bit by having "From Quanta to Quarks" (pretty much Interactions of Light and Matter) an optional component. Some of the nuclear stuff that is in "from Quanta to Quarks" we did in Unit 1 and the particle accelerators are done more in-depth in the Synchrotron detailed study.

HSC Physics does touch on a few topics we don't: transistors (that is in further electronics I think?), black body radiations, super conductivity etc. I don't think I like the idea of "Ideas to Implementation" - it seems to lump too many things into one area of study. I'm not sure, but that could lead to those topics not being covered with as much depth as it could be if it were split into separate topics.

I do reckon that the questions we do in VCE Physics could be a lot more interesting though. As you said, it needs less "calc-bashing"

[appianway]

HSC physics includes essays. The calc bashing is even less rigorous than that in VCE. One of my friends dropped a mark on her trial exam in HSC for excluding a paragraph on how transistors influence her everyday life. Really, guys, really?

[paulsterio]

HSC physics includes essays. The calc bashing is even less rigorous than that in VCE. One of my friends dropped a mark on her trial exam in HSC for excluding a paragraph on how transistors influence her everyday life. Really, guys, really?

i reckon all high school physics is a joke because to make it "fair" they can't have dependencies on other vce level knowledge - basically implying that they can't involve calculus in physics, which is a real shame...but i reckon the VCE physics course is pretty similar to the HSC one, although both look like they're formula dependent - for example, you can develop general solutions to situations such as projectile motion, banked curves...etc which require no understanding of the situation to use, and you get the right answer easily

being a known physics genius yourself, appainway, im sure you'll agree with me

and also, with regards to maths, VCE maths seems to have more of an "applied" sort of feel than the HSC maths, their maths papers look a little bit more like a competition paper to be honest, especially the last few questions...but honestly though, i do standard specialist maths and i can do up to question 6 ok (standard spesh practice exam for me) - but beyond that i doubt its actually harder but its just different...we seem to cover vectors much more thoroughly than they do for example...no vectors questions in their exam? no kinematics questions, no slope fields, differential equations...etc so i would think twice about calling vce maths a joke...they cover different (not neccessarily harder) content

[emmahudson88]

I think it could be interesting to explore the similarities different subjects to equivalent studies in different states.

It could provide as an additional resource for students to be able to freely access papers made by the related authorities.

Anyone know of any similarities at this stage?

I also think so.