Khalid

[Mao]

I have been told by a fellow member on the mod team argued that I have "double standard", and does not have impartiality in my decisions. Hence, I step down from the position as I have already declared. I will not retract that statement, but ultimately the acceptance of my resignation is up to enwiabe.

So are you resigning or not?

Hence I hereby resign from the mod team, take it as a disbelief towards some people's values.

[doboman]

Is it me, or is there great anticipation in the outcome of this thread

[Collin Li]

I know that no global moderator has asked for Khalid to be reprimanded.

Let me remind you that subject moderators do not contribute to the policy of moderation. They are assigned their role to keep their subject boards in smooth operation. I would not be afraid to say that Mao has attempted to step out of this role. Whoever asked for Khalid to be reprimanded must have been a subject moderator, or lower than that (and hence has no authority to tell Mao what to do, so who cares?).

To resign over this is showboating, power-wielding and an act of internal politics (which is usually minimal here).

[humph]

It annoys me how seriously people take moderation on this board. Moderation should, in my view, be primarily to prevent epic flamewars and harmful material. Any more than that is too much intervention, in my opinion. What Mao did was close a thread that was just incessant and irrelevant arguing - so, rapidly descending into flamewars. I didn't see anything wrong with his actions.

If you know that someone is ten years old, then you should bear this in mind when you interact with them - even if it is over the interwebs. Khalid is not going out of his way to piss people off - he just wants a little attention perhaps. If this annoys you, then ignore his threads and posts.

[Collin Li]

I agree with your non-interventionist stance. This is the status quo for moderation here, and at most forums.

I didn't find anything particularly wrong with his actions either, until this post - where he uses his moderator position as leverage. This is where he oversteps his boundary. Moderator structure should hardly be an issue, yet Mao has made a big deal about it. My point of neutrality is consistent with non-interventionism. Just because people don't agree with you, it doesn't mean you need to quit moderating.

Don't get me wrong. I am not the one who started the exaggeration. I am the one trying to expose the melodramatic nature of this act. Resigning over nothing? Like I said, the internal politics here is usually minimal. We dislike a display of power, and this is what I saw today, and fought.

[doboman]

I would not be afraid to say that Mao has attempted to step out of this role. Whoever asked for Khalid to be reprimanded must have been a subject moderator, or lower than that (and hence has no authority to tell Mao what to do, so who cares?).

To resign over this is showboating, power-wielding and an act of internal politics (which is usually minimal here).

I know i mean nothing to this board, but for some reason- this topic really hit a nerve. Exal's dealing with the whole situation has been extremely childish and rather tedious. His behaviour should not be condoned on such boards and i believe Mao was in the right when he came to close the thread. I view the boards from a different view than you Collin. And to people like me- who do not have supremacy- the perpetual arguments between Exal and Ahmad's brother were stupid and utterly shameful- and needed to be stopped. I am not fighting your character, but rather pointing out that you should try and perceive this through others' point of view

[Collin Li]

I did not fight the closure of the thread! I can reverse that decision easily, yet I didn't. If you read my posts, you will see that time and time again, I say that the moderators have the right to close threads that are getting out of hand. That is correct. That is what Mao did. All I did was maintain moderator neutrality (because he gave himself the final right of reply as if everyone was behind him).

I am attacking Mao's announcement to resign about nothing. That is all!

[humph]

I agree with your non-interventionist stance. This is the status quo for moderation here, and at most forums.

I didn't find anything particularly wrong with his actions either, until this post - where he uses his moderator position as leverage. This is where he oversteps his boundary. Moderator structure should hardly be an issue, yet Mao has made a big deal about it. My point of neutrality is consistent with non-interventionism. Just because people don't agree with you, it doesn't mean you need to quit moderating.

Don't get me wrong. I am not the one who started the exaggeration. I am the one trying to expose the melodramatic nature of this act. Resigning over nothing? Like I said, the internal politics here is usually minimal. We dislike a display of power, and this is what I saw today, and fought.

I suppose the issue is that Mao's judgements as moderator have been against Excal, who has then gone on to say that Mao's personal, subjective opinions on the issue are interfering with his (supposedly objective) duties as a moderator. Perhaps in locking the thread he was indeed subjectively forcing a point, and as such he may not be fit for the role of moderator. Clearly Mao has a strong opinion on the subject. And yes, this public display was perhaps not the best way to deal with the issue.

[Roflmao]

Omg hold on there i dont care if your Mr.Admin what are you trying to say you keep braging about  your admin who cares

"OO look at my im coblin im so smart i can make some stupid character called yoshi and change hes mood Hahaha i changed it to Yosh hits my ass"

[Collin Li]

I am not an admin. It is irrelevant. I could be a normal member, and the criticisms I lay out against Mao are just as valid.

To threaten to resign over his personal beliefs is not moderator-like. That is all. His role is to organise the maths boards. What does resigning there have to do with standing up for what he believes? I never fought against that. You have to understand that I fight for Mao's right to argue for you, but I don't support his use of power (in this thread), to try to promote his views.

[Mao]

READ

I have been asked to publicly reprimand Khalid or step down from mod due to "double standard".

[Collin Li]

I know that no global moderator has asked for Khalid to be reprimanded.

Let me remind you that subject moderators do not contribute to the policy of moderation. They are assigned their role to keep their subject boards in smooth operation. I would not be afraid to say that Mao has attempted to step out of this role. Whoever asked for Khalid to be reprimanded must have been a subject moderator, or lower than that (and hence has no authority to tell Mao what to do, so who cares?).

To resign over this is showboating, power-wielding and an act of internal politics (which is usually minimal here).

Read?

[Mao]

Why does authority matter when it comes to what is right and wrong?

I am acting to protect Khalid, and in doing so, have taken away Excel's ability to refute orsel. In a conversation that ensued, he expressed the same views as this post by you: http://vcenotes.com/forum/index.php/topic,5723.msg69117.html#msg69117

Clearly I have double standards in my treatment of Khalid the spammer and Excal the wise. His reasons were just as good as yours, what is this "authority" banner?

[Mao]

Understand this

The reason why I posted this has two purposes

1. to make Excal shut the fuck up.

2. to show people like coblin there is such thing called "emotions", and not everything is so god damn analytical and rational.

I do not need a good reason to know to protect a youngling from sadistic "mature" (if I dare say) people. If that means there will be (have been) disputes over the way I manage(d) my boards, then so be it. The fancy title is not worth the trouble, especially when I know my opponent will have been incessant and sustained in the manner of approach.

[Collin Li]

to show people like coblin there is such thing called "emotions", and not everything is so god damn analytical and rational.

Show me where I am being "so god damn analytical and rational." Just because your previous encounters with me have built up this perception, you cannot just assume it of me all the time. I can't see where this has happened. Also, you completely ignored my rebuttal before. The rational model encompasses human values and emotions. You simply have a misunderstanding of the rational model.

I understand why you love saying this though... it's an easy way to dismiss everything I've said before.


ON TOPIC:

Why does authority matter when it comes to what is right and wrong?

This is a straw-man. I don't actually believe that. Authority matters when it comes to who says what you can do. I am telling you that no one (with higher authority than you) actually gave you such an order to "reprimand Khalid." Hence there is no substantial reason behind your choice to resign. That is, even if you rebelled against this request, there would be no actions taken, as no one in command actually argued for this. This means your little protest is for nothing!

To clarify my position: I am not in opposition to the closure of that thread. If I was, I would have reversed it! The only thing I am concerned about is your display of power here, in this thread. I will reiterate my point that as a subject moderator, you are expected to keep the maths boards in order. That is your role. Now what does that role have to do with your personal beliefs on how Khalid should be treated? To quit your moderator post in protest of what Excalibur believes is nothing but a display and misuse of your position of power to sway public opinion. Those who are neutral to this matter will obviously favour you, for you are certainly a great help in maths, but this Khalid matter has no relationship to your role. This is what I am criticising.

Here, you admit it. You made this post (along with your resignation) to make Excalibur "shut the fuck up." This is clearly a showman act in an attempt to sway public opinion. It is a misuse of your power.

This is ridiculous. I agree with humphdogg, although (I think) he originally saw me as the villain. I am the one who is sticking up for a non-interventionist, no bullshit, simple and clean moderation policy. You are the one who is mixing power with personal agenda. It's not the first time you have created a "them and us" mentality (think about all the noobs you disliked, including hard) with your authority. What I am opposed to is a strongly interfering social hierarchy of power from developing.


Summary:
- no one told you to "reprimand Khalid," except someone who couldn't have put pressure on your moderator position anyway
- you use your moderator position as a leverage to propel your personal agenda (misuse of power)
- I am trying to keep VCEnotes free from a social hierarchy of power