Uni students to be taught basic English

[ninwa]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24428680-421,00.html

MONASH University will teach its first-year students grammar and punctuation after discovering that most arrive without basic English skills.

Baden Eunson, lecturer at the university's School of English, Communications and Performance Studies, and convenor of the new course, said about 90 per cent of his first-year students could not identify a noun.

"If you ask them to identify adjectives and other parts of a sentence, only about 1 per cent can manage," he said, according to The Australian.

"It is not really a surprise as only about 20 per cent of English teachers understand basic grammar."

.... ?!!?!??!

[Eriny]

But it's so easy to identify a noun, I remember doing that kind of thing in primary school and again in year 7.

Also, most high school kids learn another language, which helps with English grammar quite a lot.

The statistics seem to be anecdotal (aka, pulled out of some persons arse).

[humph]

Australians really do fail at grammar.

It should be taught in high school, not in primary school. I was taught grammar pretty rigourously throughout years 7-10 at my school in Copenhagen. You'd be surprised how useful it is.

[cara.mel]

Parts of speech is in unit 1?, as well as year 7, year 8, year 9, primary school...
(or isn't it in normal english)

[AppleThief]

Don't know about normal English, but even before I did English Language I knew the basic parts of speech, such as nouns/adjectives/verbs/adverbs/prepositions.etc. (now, I also know the more obscure ones, such as auxiliaries and determiners).

But I agree this should be taught more readily. Rules of grammar are important (even though I constantly flout the rules in my writing)

[cara.mel]

Also I think I have found the problem

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,24428680-421,00.html

MONASH University will teach its first-year students grammar and punctuation after discovering that most arrive without basic English skills.

Baden Eunson, lecturer at the university's School of English, Communications and Performance Studies, and convenor of the new course, said about 90 per cent of his first-year students could not identify a noun.

"If you ask them to identify adjectives and other parts of a sentence, only about 1 per cent can manage," he said, according to The Australian.

"It is not really a surprise as only about 20 per cent of English teachers understand basic grammar."

.... ?!!?!??!

He is teaching people who do Arts.
*runs* 0=)

[brendan]

"The critical literacy approach hammered out by Professor Freebody and his colleague Allan Luke promoted a socio-political view of the world at the expense of basic literacy," he said. "It also introduced a theoretical jargon that disenchants many students."

that's just like VCE English

[bubble sunglasses]

"The critical literacy approach hammered out by Professor Freebody and his colleague Allan Luke promoted a socio-political view of the world at the expense of basic literacy," he said. "It also introduced a theoretical jargon that disenchants many students."

that's just like VCE English

  mmmm content over form, that's why I didn't choose English

[sheepz]

lol i won't be able to identify a noun >.< i hated learning all the grammar stuff back in primary school so i always tuned out haha... not only for english, but also malay and chinese -______-;;

kinda regret it now... my chinese tutor last year said that my grammar was very weird and my year 9 english teacher (first year i migrated here) said she don't get why i make random grammar errors where in other parts of the essay it is right lol

[Eriny]

I always kind of figured that grammar is so basic, it's the kind of thing you get out of the way early, like learning how to read or learning your times tables, especially since most people who can't identify a noun probably could have it explained to them in a flash because they'd be so used to dealing with nouns and use them almost every time they talk. After that, you should be able to move to the more difficult stuff, like analysis and theory.

To say that year 12 students should study grammar is like saying that they should also be studying basic arithmetic. Some probably ought to, but most should be way over this stage by the time they're 17.

[brendan]

To say that year 12 students should study grammar is like saying that they should also be studying basic arithmetic.

Well they should be studying arithmetic if they don't know it.

[bubble sunglasses]

 i should study finance at a basic level, atm i barely know what interest rates are, even though i've still been able to enjoy a few "popular" writings on economics

[AppleThief]

I always kind of figured that grammar is so basic, it's the kind of thing you get out of the way early, like learning how to read or learning your times tables, especially since most people who can't identify a noun probably could have it explained to them in a flash because they'd be so used to dealing with nouns and use them almost every time they talk. After that, you should be able to move to the more difficult stuff, like analysis and theory.

To say that year 12 students should study grammar is like saying that they should also be studying basic arithmetic. Some probably ought to, but most should be way over this stage by the time they're 17.

Grammar is more than nouns, just like algebra is more than 1 + x = 3. Saying they should study grammar is more than saying they should study basic arithmetic.

But yes, I believe we are beyond nouns and verbs by year 12

[ninwa]

Grammar is more than nouns, just like algebra is more than 1 + x = 3. Saying they should study grammar is more than saying they should study basic arithmetic.

That's very true.

And I never realised how complex grammar could be until I started learning German grammar. Most of the more complex English grammar that I know now comes from studying German lol.