John Monash science school or haileybury?

[Russ]

Integrated technology, better access to information and learning, better student/teacher advice ratio etc.
I couldn't care less what school someone went to, but when it comes to evaluating public vs. private then there's a huge gulf between their ability to provide "education".

Tell that to some of the idiots at Xavier a few years back

To be perfectly fair, there was a huge media fiasco over that (the media are second only to pharmaceutical companies in the rankings of industries I hate). Xavier has huge cultural problems though, not denying that.

[Lasercookie]

I guess on an even more irrelevant note: Why do private schools receive government funding?

This is something I don't fully understand. I understand that every single student should have the right to education and government funding supports this ideology. I also realise that funding is due to socioeconomic location or whatever. I also realise student population is also taken into account. I also realise that some schools need the funding.

There's a local private school is earning $11 million from school fees etc. yet still receive almost the same amount of government funding as the state school I go to. They receive ~$7.5 million from the federal government and ~$1 million from the state government. My school receives ~$1 million from the federal government and ~$6.5 million from the state government (and earns about $200,000 from school fees). So they are actually making more in school fees than my school makes in total. This school has a bit under a 1000 more students than my school - so I guess they are receiving less per student from the government, but from they're total income they do have more money per student. The government funding would be to even it out (on a per student basis).

I think this local school is an example of a private school that benefits government funding. If they were left to fend for themselves with their school fees alone, they wouldn't have enough money per student.

I'm getting this data from MySchool.edu.au by the way.

And then you have the elite private schools like Scotch. According to MySchool.edu.au they make $36 million just from school fees. They receive quite a bit less government funding: ~$3.7 million from the federal government, ~$1 million from the state government. Scotch has about 1100 more students than the school I attend, so definitely receiving less per student.

However, from their school fees alone, they have about double the amount of money per student than my school (and the local private school) does. I'm sure this is the case for some of the other elite private schools as well.

I guess my question is that do they really need that government money if they're already earning so much from school fees alone? I do realise some private schools aren't as well off as Scotch, but there should be some kind of quota at least. Something like if the school earns above $30 million from school fees alone, they should be deemed as not requiring the funding. 

[chemkid_23]

@ Azure
LOL I think you misunderstood what I meant.
I was saying that the school you go to shouldn't hinder your ability to help the community, and I referenced those schools in saying that more prestigous schools have a greater opportunity to help because of who they are by reputation, name, etc. I meant if an organisation was seeking help from a school, they would obviously choose a private school like St Kevins over Dandy High, so in that regard private schools immediately have the advantage.

And with this facilities and leeching issue, I tend to agree.
Facilities do help your education, but it wouldn't maximise it. If anything, IMHO the best form of learning and studying is done at home, the school just provides the direction, it will come don to what the student themselves do. Kids at my school act like dheads and do nothing at school, but work their arses off at home and get good results.
And with leaching, I dont know if many of you know about Manchester City's situation at the moment, but before they became owned by a wealthy oil businessmen, they were nothing. All of a sudden, they are beginning to win a lot more and are gaining a reputation of being excellent and prestigous. Why? Because with the money they now have, they have began leeching the best players and are developing the world's 'greatest facilities' ever seen.

[chemkid_23]

@ laseredd
it's the same in the real world. The rich get richer, the poor.... well ye no need to retell everything we all know

[Russ]

Dan is going to rage about your Man City aspersions

I guess on an even more irrelevant note: Why do private schools receive government funding?

It's mostly a practical concern, because funding private schools saves the government money in the big picture. Private schools of course use this to argue that they need more government funding and it shouldn't be reviewed at all.

[chemkid_23]

ahahhaha he can rage all eh wants, he knows it's true ;P
and I dont see the logic of how the government will save money. Wouldn't they save more money if they didn't give our funding that realistically isn't required???

[Lasercookie]

ahahhaha he can rage all eh wants, he knows it's true ;P
and I dont see the logic of how the government will save money. Wouldn't they save more money if they didn't give our funding that realistically isn't required???

I guess it's a safer investment. Private schools perform better so the money is better spent?

[chemkid_23]

With the exception of Xavier, I guess so.
But couldn't that funding further assist schools that perhaps need more?? So in turn they may (or not) have more kids do will??.......

[Lasercookie]

With the exception of Xavier, I guess so.
But couldn't that funding further assist schools that perhaps need more?? So in turn they may (or not) have more kids do will??.......

Yeah, that's what I don't like. Funding is going to schools that don't really need it (from what I can see anyway - I might be unaware of some important factor here).

But like you said, the rich get richer and the poor get the picture  

[azure]

@ Chemkid: Hmm... I don't think charitable organisations are selective like that lol... Kind of a volunteer system...

What I fail to understand is why state schools don't place greater emphasis on social interests. It's a concerning part of society (inequity) and I think the world will benefit if we are more educated on the importance of giving back to society regardless of the circumstances we are in. We don't always need money to help...

Greater exposure to the necessity of helping others will more likely produce a cohort of students with great ambitions to do some good for society. I personally think that having the motivation and aspiration to aid others less fortunate is equally if not more important than our academic performance. Not to mention, wanting to help others will give us a greater incentive to do well academically anyway.

[REBORN]

Humans are selfish by nature....keep that in mind. Selflessness is not found in the majority of people. It's great that you seem to possess this attribute though.

[Lasercookie]

I'm not sure what you mean by emphasising social interests? What activities are you wanting the schools to do?

I don't know about what state schools you've been to, but my school involves itself in instilling good values and stuff a fair bit.

[chemkid_23]

state schools don't place a greater emphasis on it because they don't have the resources for it.

and if anything private schools who receive great funding can use that extra money to give to those in need, rather than continue with extra expansions that may not really be needed.

and it is true that you dont need the money to help others, and it really should be your own willingness to do so. But money does help you help others, it makes things easier and more organised.

and think about this. Would you rather a kid from Doveton for example be in charge of the door knock appeals, in regards to ensuring that EVERY cent comes back to the organisation, or some kid from Toorak??

[Lasercookie]

and think about this. Would you rather a kid from Doveton for example be in charge of the door knock appeals, in regards to ensuring that EVERY cent comes back to the organisation, or some kid from Toorak??

I don't think that has much to do with schools, but more that it's stereotyping and discriminating based on the suburb.

I'm sure schools don't actively encourage bad behaviour and the other stuff that goes on in what are thought to be dodgy suburbs.
I'm also sure the schools try to do their bit to make sure their students don't involve themselves in crime etc.

[azure]

Humans are selfish by nature....keep that in mind. Selflessness is not found in the majority of people. It's great that you seem to possess this attribute though.

Hmm... I think selflessness or at least partial selflessness can always be developed. That's where education comes into play Lack of knowledge may be the reason why others don't really see the importance of helping one another... maybe...