misogyny in hip hop

[bluehorizon]

wats ur general opinion about this? detrimental to society? amusing aspect of music? trivial, minimal effect? could also relate to everything else frowned upon in rap music - boasting, immorality, swearing, dissing, etc. ur thoughts?

[brenden]

I wouldn't say the effect is trivial. With no male equivalent for 'bitch' and with 'slut' having only negative connotations for females etc etc it's probably detrimental to gender equality if only on an unconscious level. It could be argued "oh everyone makes their own decision" but, half the people that listen to it and then go spouting it probably are not capable of their own decisions. Boasting, immorality and swearing are a bit different imo

[JellyDonut]

Let me guess, you heard Bitch Bad by Lupe Fiasco?

but, half the people that listen to it and then go spouting it probably are not capable of their own decisions.

Oh? How so?

[brenden]

Oh? How so?

I'll just narrow my generalisation a bit and say people that unquestioningly accept things they receive from various forms of media and vomit out the bullshit they've picked up probably shouldn't be making their own decisions.

[JellyDonut]

Oh? How so?

I'll just narrow my generalisation a bit and say people that unquestioningly accept things they receive from various forms of media and vomit out the bullshit they've picked up probably shouldn't be making their own decisions.

Why not? And making their decisions on what? To listen to rap?

@OP: I don't know the general effect it has on society because considering its diverse fanbase, it'd be hard to draw any proper conclusions. Is it a concern? Sure, just like any other acts of misogyny. However, audience should be able to identify the music as escapism and a failure to do so isn't the fault of the rapper

[brenden]

Would you let a 6 year old make all of their own decisions? To bring it back into my original context, probably not capable of making their own decisions as to the equality of women and men if they're unquestioningly accepting and repeating misogyny. Listening to a form of music is within the decision making capabilities of everyone.

[Thu Thu Train]

Sometimes my lyrics are sexist, but you lovely bitches know, should know, that I'm trying to correct this.

[JellyDonut]

I wouldn't let 6 year olds make all of their decisions because their mental faculties aren't fully developed. This can hardly be adapted to your argument so I still can't see the basis for your assumption. Misogyny doesn't necessarily imply an inability in decision making. It could very well be a result of various environmental factors

[nacho]

Would you let a 6 year old make all of their own decisions? To bring it back into my original context, probably not capable of making their own decisions as to the equality of women and men if they're unquestioningly accepting and repeating misogyny. Listening to a form of music is within the decision making capabilities of everyone.

most of the population unquestioningly accepts and repeats what they are taught.
eg what they hear from the media
why narrow it down to people who listen to rap music?
It's a rather unreasonable thing to say

Essentially, the question is, are people treating women worse as a result of misogyny in rap music. I'd say no.
You could say the same thing about words like 'nigger' in rap music. there isn't some revolt against black people now is therE?

[brenden]

Misogyny was less the focus of the generalisation and more people who 'unquestioningly accept things they receive from various forms of media and vomit out the bullshit they've picked up.' For the above description, their mental faculties probably aren't fully developed.

@nacho, see above. My intention wasn't to narrow it down to people that listen to rap music. Otherwise I'd be calling myself a toddler.

[tortoise]

It depends on what form of rap you listen to, if you listen to the mainstream such as Lil Wayne, Rick Ross, etc. and all those other talentless nobodies then yes, you will find a decent amount of perecieved 'misogyny'through lyrics. As someone here stated, hip-hop is just escapism, Rick Ross claims his a gangster and a thug who hates the police but he used to be a correctional officer.

Underground hip hop I've noticed has much less misogyny and it's more about perfecting one's lyrical craft, then make music which you can boogey to (which is what the mainstream typically focuses on)

You have also take into account that a lot of people who listen to the mainstream form of rap, generally only listen to the beat and hardly take into account the lyrics.

I doubt however.. that if you listen to say 2Pac or Biggie that somehow will transform you into a misogynst.. or make you more likely to be so.

Don't plame people for becoming morally corrupt because of some tenets of hip-hop having violent or misogynist lyrics.. otherwise you'll have to blame the band 'Cannibal Corpse' for glorifying and endorsing genocide, murder, necrophilia, cannibalism, etc.

[bluehorizon]

i was thinking more along the lines of graphic imagery, like eminem's 'kim'.

to think that hip hop is 'just' escapism is perhaps not entirely accurate...it's often incorrect to narrow stuff into 'just' this or 'just' that

fair point about underground hip hop, but i'm thinking about the effects of misogyny in hip hop, not whether or not misogyny is an underlying theme in every field of hip hop.

i agree that the negativity in rap would have a negligible effect on a truly immoral, corrupt person, but what about on wider society? sounding like an english prompt, to what extent is misogyny in hip hop conducive to that which permeates the entire world?

personally i don't know. thats why im asking.

but consider a third-world country where there is still rigid misogyny but where they may have never listened to hip hop.
in contrast, whilst there is still misogyny in australia, it is perhaps to a lesser degree to that of a third-world country, despite the fact that australians are exposed to rap.

conversely, it's hard to think that such blatant immorality which reaches such a wide audience is harmless.

[JellyDonut]

I'm saying that listeners, and most already do, should view hip-hop as escapism - as opposed to categorising it as escapism. The reaction towards 'Kim' is a perfect example of how people have been able to distinguish between escapism and reality.

[slothpomba]

2Pac actually had some really deep messages if you listen to his songs and think about them.

Hopsin's latest song was also against a lot of the things rap/hip hop is meant to stand for:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRVOOwFNp5U

Pretty good, give it a listen.

Don't think hip-hop alone will do much. It's more falling in with a certain group of people/culture.

[bluehorizon]

zig ziglar put it better than me, if u disagree with my definition of 'expectations'
expect the best
prepare for the worst
enjoy the result