Help! B.Sc @ Melb or Monash MBBS?

[sodapop]

Thanks everyone! And thanks for answering in so much detail Shinny!
Since change of prefs have ended, I had Monash MBBS CSP, then ERC, then Bonded, followed by Biomed then Science. You're right Shinny, I won't know if I'll like it until I do it.  But do you guys think I might be able to apply for an irregular offer into Biomed if I get Bonded and decide (after an extra month's thought) that I'd rather attempt Biomed then sign on for Bonded?

So to summarise: MBBS is a tough course, 80%+ is very hard.    But it is do-able right? I'm hoping to apply for some merit-based accommodation scholarships.

I'm wondering also about the Dip. Lang or Dip. Liberal Arts - how do they work in conjunction with the MBBS? (Can't find any info online.)

And I read somewhere about the MBBS/PhD - do the Monash people have any info about this? I've combed the Monash website, but can't find anything.

Also, regarding the difference in "prestige" between Monash and UniMelb, would this affect acquiring an internship? I've been following the news about the intern crisis...do you guys think this will still be a concern in several years' time?

Sorry about all the questions, I've tried looking up everything online, but couldn't find much information. Thank you all for helping out, it means a lot.

[shinny]

Thanks everyone! And thanks for answering in so much detail Shinny!
Since change of prefs have ended, I had Monash MBBS CSP, then ERC, then Bonded, followed by Biomed then Science. You're right Shinny, I won't know if I'll like it until I do it.  But do you guys think I might be able to apply for an irregular offer into Biomed if I get Bonded and decide (after an extra month's thought) that I'd rather attempt Biomed then sign on for Bonded?

With your scores, I'm sure Melb Uni is more than happy to take you on under an irregular offer.

So to summarise: MBBS is a tough course, 80%+ is very hard.    But it is do-able right? I'm hoping to apply for some merit-based accommodation scholarships.

Definitely do-able. Getting 80+ in any single year isn't too bad if you try hard, but the issue is maintaining that consistent effort over 5 years, which is the difficult part really.

Also, regarding the difference in "prestige" between Monash and UniMelb, would this affect acquiring an internship? I've been following the news about the intern crisis...do you guys think this will still be a concern in several years' time?

There's a general bias towards Monash hospitals (south/east side hospitals plus The Alfred) wanting Monash students, and UoM's hospitals (north/west side plus all the other city hospitals). Apparently this bias has been broken a bit nowadays somewhat, but I'm sure it still exists to some degree. Royal Melbourne's intake still seems mostly to be UoM at the moment, with The Austin now down to about half/half between UoM/Monash from what I've heard from a doctor who was there last year as an intern. But in terms of whether it affects your chances of getting an internship, I guess that depends on which hospital you're trying to get into. In terms of whether it'll still be an issue by the time you graduate, well, let's hope not. Seems like work's being done at the moment to ameliorate it, but it hasn't been completely solved yet.

[pi]

Won't cover what shinny has covered

I'm wondering also about the Dip. Lang or Dip. Liberal Arts - how do they work in conjunction with the MBBS? (Can't find any info online.)

Basically you can apply for this in second year if you have a first year average of 60%+ There are a whole lot of options you have in there (perhaps Thushan might be able to help more as he's taking one on).

And I read somewhere about the MBBS/PhD - do the Monash people have any info about this? I've combed the Monash website, but can't find anything.

It's a 7 year program where you extend your BMedSci into a PhD afaik. It has been approved as well (i think).

As for links for the above two queries, I can't find any either haha

[thushan]

Hey Sodapop -

Basically you do 1 Arts subject per semester (you might have to take at least one summer subject as well) in a particular major - I'm doing Philosophy, for instance.

You do this subject on top of your med degree, so there may be some issue with timetabling. To get around this, I plan to have my arts tutes scheduled for the morning when the med lectures are - I don't go to lectures - and not go to the Arts lectures.

And the MBBS/PhD is an 8 year program actually I think. Well, 7-8.

And as for getting 80+ in a single year, it's definitely doable. Very hard, but doable. We have people with 90+ averages in our year.

[VivaTequila]

You can always drop out of med and do Science at UoM.

And you can always do Science and then postgraduate med.

Just think of how long it'll take you in years to do what you want.

If you don't like med, drop out, and use the remainder as a gap year. I have a friend that did Med at Adelaide and hated it, wanted to do mathematical physics and just picked med for the hell of the ATAR + successful interview.

Then the next year, go and pick up BSc at Melb, and then you've only spent 4 years doing what could be 3 years otherwise, plus you'll go on to further study, with the invaluable experience of knowing that Medicine isn't for you and seeing a completely different side of academia.

Or, do a BSc at Melb, and then continue with postgraduate Medicine and decide you don't like it. You still take 4 years to get to the same point. You'll either hate med or love it, so which you pick first doesn't really matter.

I'd almost pick Med first because the opportunity to be in a guaranteed pathway doesn't come up often - you might not get into a great university as easily at the end of a BSc degree - so why waste the opportunity here when I'm sure it's much easier to get into Melbourne at the end of next year if you drop out of med.

Also, I'm very happy that you enjoyed reading the stuff that I posted for Nisha! Edit the post and link it correctly, though!

[sodapop]

Thanks Shinny, pi, Thushan and VivaTequila.  (I haven't wanted to post here quite yet because offers haven't come out yet and asking too much will get my hopes up...but thank you all so much for your help.)

And @ Viva, Hey, I didn't realise that option existed, but yeah, sounds like a good one to contemplate (MBBS, then BSc if need be.) Hmm...there's no transferring into the MD from the MBBS right? It's just that my parents were suggesting it (because they want to keep me at home), but I don't think it's do-able anyway. And yup, fixed the link! Woops.

Moderator action: removed real name, sorry for the inconvenience

[Russ]

No, you're right, you can't transfer between them. MD has more assumed knowledge, amongst other reasons. Gluck

[thushan]

Thanks Shinny, pi, Thushan and VivaTequila.  (I haven't wanted to post here quite yet because offers haven't come out yet and asking too much will get my hopes up...but thank you all so much for your help.)

And @ Viva, Hey, I didn't realise that option existed, but yeah, sounds like a good one to contemplate (MBBS, then BSc if need be.) Hmm...there's no transferring into the MD from the MBBS right? It's just that my parents were suggesting it (because they want to keep me at home), but I don't think it's do-able anyway. And yup, fixed the link! Woops.

Transferring between medical schools is near impossible. The only thing that could allow a transfer is if you have absolutely extenuating circumstances (say your husband has a job interstate and you have a daughter you are looking after and he can't move states because of his job). Even then, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to transfer between an undergraduate medical school and a graduate medical school, especially one that offers an MD as opposed to MBBS (the whole bachelors vs masters thing).

Moderator action: removed real name, sorry for the inconvenience

[Russ]

Yeah you're right,  an MBBS student can't transfer into the MD. If you want to transfer to an interstate university, it's possible/easier but still a pain to get these things sorted.

[thushan]

"There's a general bias towards Monash hospitals (south/east side hospitals plus The Alfred) wanting Monash students, and UoM's hospitals (north/west side plus all the other city hospitals). Apparently this bias has been broken a bit nowadays somewhat, but I'm sure it still exists to some degree. Royal Melbourne's intake still seems mostly to be UoM at the moment, with The Austin now down to about half/half between UoM/Monash from what I've heard from a doctor who was there last year as an intern. But in terms of whether it affects your chances of getting an internship, I guess that depends on which hospital you're trying to get into. In terms of whether it'll still be an issue by the time you graduate, well, let's hope not. Seems like work's being done at the moment to ameliorate it, but it hasn't been completely solved yet."

Hmm. Now this, along with what I've heard from sources, makes me frown a little. It's all well and good to say that all medical schools are accredited, and all courses will be off relatively similar quality and you can't say Uni X is better than Uni Y in med as much as you can other degrees. Assuming the tsunami is resolved, internship's guaranteed, fair enough. But where you get your internship - is this very important? I heard the following and am not sure what to make of it:

If you want to get into a competitive specialty, it is paramount that you get into a top-tier hospital as an intern, because the connections you make there will be really important in getting a residency in a top-tier hospital, and the connections there will be really really important in getting into this competitive specialty. In other words, getting into a competitive specialty from a lower tier hospital is very very difficult.

Now. Are the top tier hospitals RMH, StV, Alfred and MMC? Or just RMH, StV, Austin and the Alfred?

If it's the latter...then if a Monash student wanted to get into a competitive specialty down the track, it would be much more difficult than for a UoM student - NOT BECAUSE ONE UNI IS BETTER THAN THE OTHER - but more due to this inherent bias and affiliations with specific hospitals.

This is the impression I'm under now. Not too concerned, more curious. Also - well either way I have to work hard, fair enough, but I guess if I know the beast I am facing I can face it better. Is this right (as in, have I misunderstood sth)?

I would post this on MSO, but I get the feeling I'd be flamed by the mods there.

[Russ]

I think you're overestimating how important location of internship is to everything else. The idea that you can't get into specialty X if you do your internship at Wimmera Base Hospital isn't really accurate.

Also I don't think it's really surprising that UoM provides better networking potential, that's pretty standard

[thushan]

Oh, I'm not surprised or anything, I'm just checking the size of the beast I was facing