University Cuts

[Professor Polonsky]

It's unfortunate, but a crappy consequence of us bottling revenues at 25% of GDP, and a public unwilling to accept deficits. You have to cut in order to raise spending. God, America would be proud of us. Every Republican's wet dream. (Except for defence spending, of course, because that's always allowed.)

[Professor Polonsky]

THE Coalition is refusing to rule out deregulating university fees, saying it will release its higher education policies closer to the next election.

Yesterday, News Ltd reported that the Coalition was considering increasing fees by 25 per cent, which would raise the cost of a medical degree to $73,000.

The report said a government led by Tony Abbott would also introduce a new cap on university places, saving $2.6 billion over five years, by slashing university places by 200,000.

Source

[alondouek]

That's pretty disappointing, though the article is from August 27th, 2012...

Perhaps the backlash to Labor's announcing of the cuts will force them to amend/scrap whatever policy they were considering then, if they haven't already done so in the 8 months since that article was published.

[Special At Specialist]

In terms of the economy (taxes, funding, cuts, loans etc.), I think that liberal is better than labour, since they are actually doing something to prevent Australia from becoming another victim of the GFC, but in terms of policies (laws, equality and rights), liberal is completely messed up. Tony Abbott wouldn't even allow the liberal MP's to have a conscious vote on gay marriage, and he is such a stuck up, lying, delusional bigot that I can't stand to see him in office.

Both are horrible choices. Australia has some serious problems. I'm going to vote for either the Green's or the Sex Party because they are the only hope that we have (and even then, I'm not too confident in that decision).

[alondouek]

^This, except for the part about voting Greens or ASP

I'd much rather see Turnbull or Bishop heading the party - though really anyone but Abbott. Also they should pull their heads out of their arses regarding NBN, but small steps...

[lala1911]

I don't see it having much of an effect, actually.

- Who actually pays their fees upfront? This won't affect THAT many people and I don't really see how it could affect anyone? For an average student, I'm assuming their university fees would be around... $25,000? (just an estimation). So if someone can pay $22,500 up front just like that, I don't see another $2,500 being such a major issue.

- It doesn't sound that bad, really. Scholarships can provide a student like $10,000 throughout their university course. "Pay back after they enter the workforce". So, they may be paying it back slowly.. slowly.. until it's completely paid back. I'd just think of it as an addition loan to the HECS.

------- THIS, is the major concern. To cut the costs entirely will affect some students. I know for a fact there are people out there who can't afford the costs associated with university, so it'll be a struggle for those people to get through that..

[Mao]

Wait. Did everyone miss the part about 'efficiency dividend'?

Dr Emerson said the government would place a 2 per cent "efficiency dividend" on university funding in 2014 and 1.25 per cent the next year, saving about $900 million. This comes just as universities begin pay negotiations expected to increase wages bills by 4 per cent. 

Student subsidies is a separate issue, but this efficiency dividend will have stupid consequences. One of Australia's biggest export is education, which was harmed severly when The Rudd/Gillard government cut full fee positions, and all universities took a giant pay cut. Every department I know of has been downsizing ever since, none of the universities have recovered from this loss.

Universities may seem to be undergoing excessive growth by uncapped enrolments, but that is the only way universities can make that loss back. They aren't allowed to set prices, so they can only increase enrolments, increase class sizes and decrease the frequency of classes, something I've seen first hand over the past few years. The number of 2% and 1.25% may seem small, but it will have absolutely huge detrimental effects on the quality of higher education.

Cutting full fee places is one of the most stupid moves I've seen.

On a side note, this:

The government will also scrap the 10 per cent discount given to students who pay their university fees upfront, saving $230 million.

This just shows what kind of mentality our Labor government has. Why would anyone wish to pay off their debts early? They as a government can't seem to comprehend the idea of paying off a debt, nor should any of their citizens. This is absolutely stupid.

And lastly,

A further $1.2 billion will be saved by requiring students to pay back their $2000 start-up scholarships once they enter the workforce and once an earning threshold is reached. The 80 per cent-plus of university undergraduates who rely on government-funded deferred payment of fees will not be affected.

It's funny to see they cut their own policies which they believed in with so much. This is the only funding cut I agree with.

[nubs]

In terms of the economy (taxes, funding, cuts, loans etc.), I think that liberal is better than labour, since they are actually doing something to prevent Australia from becoming another victim of the GFC, but in terms of policies (laws, equality and rights), liberal is completely messed up. Tony Abbott wouldn't even allow the liberal MP's to have a conscious vote on gay marriage, and he is such a stuck up, lying, delusional bigot that I can't stand to see him in office.

Both are horrible choices. Australia has some serious problems.

I disagree with most of what you wrote. Firstly, I believe that history clearly shows Labor having much, much better management of the economy. What makes you think the conservative party's economic policies were at all more beneficial to this country? What have the liberals and the coalition done for our economy that overshadows the fruitful efforts of past Labor leaders? What has Gillard's administration done and what is Abbott's administration proposing to do that makes you think the coalition will be much better for our economy?
I definitely agree that the ALP is a cut above the Coalition when it comes to social issues.

Your last statement, that Australia has some 'serious issues' and that both main parties are 'horrible choices' is pretty concerning to me. What are these 'serious issues' Australia is facing? Surely you're exaggerating, you make it sound like riots are about to take place all over the country due to shit house governing.  Pretty sure that out of every country with a highly developed economy, Australia's economy is easily in one of the best conditions.

[Mao]

Firstly, I believe that history clearly shows Labor having much, much better management of the economy. What makes you think the conservative party's economic policies were at all more beneficial to this country? What have the liberals and the coalition done for our economy that overshadows the fruitful efforts of past Labor leaders? What has Gillard's administration done and what is Abbott's administration proposing to do that makes you think the coalition will be much better for our economy?

(http://imgur.com/2dLwyzE for full size image)
Would you like me to highlight which sections are associated with Labor and which with the Coalition?

Pre-2008 debt levels:


http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au/history

[Professor Polonsky]

Debt is quite possibly the last thing I'd look at when measuring an economy's strength.

[Hancock]

Re the article above:

But it has been resisting calls by the Group of Eight – Australia's established universities – to deregulate fees and allow universities to set their own costs.
Mr Pyne said a Coalition government would reintroduce full-fee paying places, but supported the government's un-capping of university places, which took full effect this year.

Well fuck me sideways, that's not good news. Looks like the Go8 want to charge heaps like the Ivies.

[Mao]

Re the article above:

Well fuck me sideways, that's not good news. Looks like the Go8 want to charge heaps like the Ivies.

What is wrong with the Ivies? The standard of education there (alongside their equivalent on the West coast) is still by far the best in the world.

[Mao]

Debt is quite possibly the last thing I'd look at when measuring an economy's strength.

Right, just like how my credit card balance is the last thing I'd look at when I'm assessing my personal finances.

[Hancock]

What is wrong with the Ivies? The standard of education there (alongside their equivalent on the West coast) is still by far the best in the world.

Nothing wrong with them, I'm looking at going myself. Its just that I don't believe that domestic students should pay full-fee but I think that's just because of the mentality of when I started higher-education (after the removal of capped places, obliteration of full-fee spots, etc.).

[ninwa]

(Image removed from quote.) (http://imgur.com/2dLwyzE for full size image)
Would you like me to highlight which sections are associated with Labor and which with the Coalition?

Pre-2008 debt levels:
(Image removed from quote.)

http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au/history

Do you really want to get into this debate again? this this and this

Coalition supporters sure are good at burying their heads in the sand.