Euthanasia?

[GalacticProcess]

I agree with what some of you have said. In my opinion, euthanasia should be legalised. In the case of terminal disease, when a patient is in extreme pain and suffering, and there is no cure for the disease, their seems to be no reason why euthanasia shouldn't be an option. Not only does that disease effect the patient, but also their family members. It may even become a burden to some, due to the expenses of palliative care and what not. Not always a burden, but some family members can suffer because they can't cope with seeing another family member in pain and distress. I read somewhere a few days ago, that in 2005, a nurse killed her father who had bowel cancer, and attempted to kill her mother, who had dementia, because she couldn't see her parents suffer. At that stage in life, one is merely alive, not living.

I feel like I just tried to convince you to accept my point of view. Please don't think I did haha.

[Potatohater]

I had to debate this topic in both the year 9 and 10 competition, was on the side of saying it should remain Illeagal both times and lost both times, I wonder why...
Well the why would be because it's so hard to come up with valid points as to why euthanasia is a bad thing. If it's done in a proper and safe manner and consent is given, all that jazz, then it should be fine. In the end it is up to the person to decide if they wanna risk the suffering and fight till the bitter end or finish it all early nice and peacefully.
However I totally understand the point of view from those that disagree because I have spent those few hours fighting for that side in the past.

[EEEEEEP]

I come from a POV that's seen first hand about in re to Euthanasia.

I was a Lifeline volunteer and I helped people in pain and mental anguish. Some had depression,some had terminal illness.   

Sometimes I recognize voices and people who said they "wanted to die", ended up thanking me for saving their life.  I'll spare you the grizzly details, but I have heard of horrible, horrible stories, some too horrific to detail here.

For this , I am not a supporter of Euthanasia.

Believe me, I understand the argument of pain, but sometimes when the path seems at it's end, some people do end up finding light =)

[GalacticProcess]

I come from a POV that's seen first hand about in re to Euthanasia.

I was a Lifeline volunteer and I helped people in pain and mental anguish. Some had depression,some had terminal illness.   

Sometimes I recognize voices and people who said they "wanted to die", ended up thanking me for saving their life.  I'll spare you the grizzly details, but I have heard of horrible, horrible stories, some too horrific to detail here.

For this , I am not a supporter of Euthanasia.

Believe me, I understand the argument of pain, but sometimes when the path seems at it's end, some people do end up finding light =)

But if it was legalised, can't the person just choose whether or not they wanted it?

[EEEEEEP]

But if it was legalised, can't the person just choose whether or not they wanted it?

They can, but sometimes that is "misguided" as they believe that they cannot be helped or saved, when they can.

If they wanted death and got it, life for them would be ended just there.

[GalacticProcess]

They can, but sometimes that is "misguided" as they believe that they cannot be helped or saved, when they can.

If they wanted death and got it, life for them would be ended just there.

Even in the case of terminal illness, where a cure and recovery is pretty much impossible?

[EEEEEEP]

Even in the case of terminal illness, where a cure and recovery is pretty much impossible?

It's hard to say for me really.

I've heard about people kind of find solace in terminal illness and live life to their potential.

One striking story for me, is about a lady who shall not be named, who wanted to become a doctor. They were suffering from lupus and if you are familiar (lupus is a life threatening illness that is incurable). Lupus flares up every now and then.

They ended up becoming a doctor and are now helping people in and out of the hospital.

Part of me kind of wants to see positives in the potential for people and to helping people fulfill their dreams.

[K888]

It's hard to say for me really.

I've heard about people kind of find solace in terminal illness and live life to their potential.

One striking story for me, is about a lady who shall not be named, who wanted to become a doctor. They were suffering from lupus and if you are familiar (lupus is a life threatening illness that is incurable). Lupus flares up every now and then.

They ended up becoming a doctor and are now helping people in and out of the hospital.

Part of me kind of wants to see positives in the potential for people and to helping people fulfill their dreams.

Yeah but like, I fail to see how lupus is a relevant example. It's not a terminal illness, and can be treated/managed.

Like, maybe younger people might manage to "make" something out of their terminal illness - advocate for awareness for the condition, etc. but still, in the end, for young and old, death is incredibly unpleasant. It's not slipping away peacefully, it's pain, struggling for breath, etc.

If euthanasia is legalised, I feel like most people who use it will be from a much older demographic. Is someone who is 83 and suffering from terminal cancer going to have a massively profound experience, suddenly find meaning in life or realise an uncovered potential? Probably not. They're just going to suffer.

anecdote, but not fishing for sympathy

I watched my grandmother die from terminal cancer. It was horrific. And the suffering she went through, and seeing one of the most stoic, independent women I've ever met, lose her independence, is what still upsets me to this day. She, and all of my family, would have liked it if she had the chance to die on her own terms and skip constant pain and suffering

[vox nihili]

Not at all.

legal rights for women are always morally acceptable, but legal rights for women were enacted due to the movements in the 1900s (after much lobbying). Thus the gender equality laws for women are representative of social values in society (and what society deems morally right).

Legality is not the same as morality, but morality for something can determine legality in regards to an issue (in the present or the future)?

This is a false equivalency. Legal rights for women were enacted because of the overwhelming evidence that denying them such rights is harmful to women and harmful to society more generally. It was not a question of what was moral or immoral, but a question of the government preventing harm.

That these rights were fought for by suffragettes, feminists etc doesn't mean that they were fought on moral grounds.



Euthanasia is, on the other hand, a fundamentally moral question and should therefore should not be subject to unreasonable restrictions under the law.

[Russ]

Euthanasia has clearly apparent practical concerns that a government could consider in the context of individual and societal 'harms'.
Governments absolutely direct a legislative agenda according to social values.

I think both of the above points are irrelevant to what this thread is trying to discuss though :/

[dan964]

Euthanasia is problematic, society should not dictate or value people simply based on "productivity".
Worth looking at some of the statistics in the Netherlands and Belgium.
https://www.ieb-eib.org/en/document/report-2016-euthanasia-in-netherlands-488.html

The problem is no laws being proposed offer protections for those who actually want to live; nor doctors who for good reasons object to such a practice.
It has serious consequences with regards to medical practice, and I think having the presumption that death is better than pain, I think is kind of superficial.

I can see the argument for self-autonomy, but again, it is not the place for the government to place an obligation on doctors to perform such wish.
With regards to terminal illness, I can see why people would think such, but is that really worth staking a life on?

On the one hand we are trying to prevent suicide amongst young people, and then encouraging our society to eliminate those that are too burdensome, or because their suffering is too much? (Think also same argument used to abort babies with down syndrome, because of the "suffering" they will experience). This really is a depressing and degrading view of humanity. Suffering is part of the human experience, I think because the implications are harmful for our society in general outweight the individual 'benefits' (which really is just a  misaligned retrieval ethic).

[vox nihili]

The problem is no laws being proposed offer protections for those who actually want to live; nor doctors who for good reasons object to such a practice.

You’re entitled to your own view and whilst I disagree with you I respect it. You are not, however, entitled to your own facts.

The laws being debated in the Victorian parliament this week provide robust protections for doctors who don’t want to prescribe euthanasia drugs. The idea they don’t provide protections for those who want to live is a bit farfetched. You have to actively make the choice to pursue euthanasia, so if you don’t want it, you certainly won’t be able to access it. There are also a lot of hurdles that need to be jumped to gain access. Patients must see multiple doctors and successfully demonstrate to them that they understand the consequences of their decision, wish to proceed with it and are competent to make that decision. They also need to prove to their doctors that they will be dead within 12 months otherwise. 

[hegihugo]

I believe that euthanasia should be legalised. As it is ultimately a persons choice to do what they want to do in their life. I feel like euthanasia is a form of ending the pain. Sure, it may not abide to some people religions/ beliefs, but it is a persons choice do what they want in their life, I feel that people shouldn't try to control others lives, and I personally feel that banning euthanasia is a form playing god. For decades, euthanasia has been used by other countries to end somebodies despair.

With regards to what dan964 has said, euthanasia isn't supposed to be practised if somebody has a cold, the point of euthanasia is that it can be completed if there is no other option left (cure). Sure, people can do whatever they want with their lives, if somebody has a terminal illness and still wants to try and contribute to society, than good on them, they will be able to do that, because ultimately euthanasia is their choice, not the choice of their families.

Doctors are trained professionals, they know that their job involves the chance of a patient dying, so what difference does it make, if the doctor assisted the patient in a suicide?

Also, I have no idea how euthanasia correlates to encouraging our youth to committing suicide, could you please eloborate?

Euthanasia is problematic, society should not dictate or value people simply based on "productivity".
Worth looking at some of the statistics in the Netherlands and Belgium.
https://www.ieb-eib.org/en/document/report-2016-euthanasia-in-netherlands-488.html

I think having the presumption that death is better than pain, I think is kind of superficial.

I can see the argument for self-autonomy, but again, it is not the place for the government to place an obligation on doctors to perform such wish.
With regards to terminal illness, I can see why people would think such, but is that really worth staking a life on?

On the one hand we are trying to prevent suicide amongst young people, and then encouraging our society to eliminate those that are too burdensome, or because their suffering is too much? (Think also same argument used to abort babies with down syndrome, because of the "suffering" they will experience). This really is a depressing and degrading view of humanity. Suffering is part of the human experience, I think because the implications are harmful for our society in general outweigh the individual 'benefits'.

Euthanasia is problematic, society should not dictate or value people simply based on "productivity".
Worth looking at some of the statistics in the Netherlands and Belgium.
https://www.ieb-eib.org/en/document/report-2016-euthanasia-in-netherlands-488.html