Criticisms of the VCE

[periwinkle]

  hey, aren't ILMM and ninwa both connected to the XLL Academy?
   You can duel to the death at the next class. Choose your weapons now

[Cthulhu]

FISTICUFFS.

[IntoTheNewWorld]

but the way you are linking that to your belief that you should have received a higher ENTER is what is irking people.

Indeed. I believe your perception of ENTER and effort aren't realistic due to the school you are in, as is mine. As Enwiabe mentioned, there are no doubt people out there that have worked just as hard as you, or even harder for an ENTER nowhere near as high as yours.

[ninwa]

Look ilmm, just forget it. We're not here to antagonize you, which is how you appear to be feeling about this now. It's natural to be disappointed, but it's almost been two whole months! You've got a whole career ahead of you, it's too small a thing to get bogged down over.

Debating the validity of having English in the top 4 is fine, and can happen without any antagonization whatsoever, but the way you are linking that to your belief that you should have received a higher ENTER is what is irking people.

Yeah, this is stupid. If you refuse to see your own arguments to their logical conclusion then there's nothing anyone can do about that.

But I think it would do you well to read enwiabe's post and perhaps gain some humility/empathy/perspective.

Also, as a commerce student, you'll be doing a lot of wordy subjects with much essay writing. Probably for your own benefit that you suck it up and get used to it.

[Cthulhu]

I don't understand why English is scaled down in fact I don't understand why English is scaled down at all. If its [the only] compulsory subject why not just leave it as the raw study score? I think the scaling down is a bigger disadvantage to students than the actual subject being in the top four itself.

Hint: I'm trying to start a new topic of conversation.

[NE2000]

but the way you are linking that to your belief that you should have received a higher ENTER is what is irking people.

Indeed. I believe your perception of ENTER and effort aren't realistic due to the school you are in, as is mine. As Enwiabe mentioned, there are no doubt people out there that have worked just as hard as you, or even harder for an ENTER nowhere near as high as yours.

Fair point. On the topic of perception of ENTER and effort, imagine if you were at James Ruse Agricultural High School in NSW, getting a 99.75 would mean you're barely above the median, and just less than half of your school's year got higher than you....

[NE2000]

I don't understand why English is scaled down in fact I don't understand why English is scaled down at all. If its [the only] compulsory subject why not just leave it as the raw study score? I think the scaling down is a bigger disadvantage to students than the actual subject being in the top four itself.

It's all about competition. I think the Literature and English Language cohorts may be marginally brighter than the English one, which leads to the differences in scaling.

[IntoTheNewWorld]

Scaling isn't manually determined by some bored person at VCAA/VTAC >_>

Statistical moderation is always going to be more fair than manual adjustment (LOTE isn't meant to be fair, it's an incentive).

[ninwa]

I'm not sure if I agree that people could have worked more than me for a lower ENTER. Not sure if nature permits this to happen. You can't possibly have worked more than me and got a lower ENTER score.

Not everyone's as smart as you are. Geez.


Anyway.
I think one of the problems with VCE is that in languages with SL components, the FL threshold is too high.

For example, I would have qualified for Chinese SL even though it is incredibly easy for me (I speak Chinese at home, it's my first language though I would've failed at Chinese FL) and would have been extremely unfair on the people for whom it is actually a second language. I think someone mentioned that the majority of 40+ names in the newspaper for Chinese SL were Chinese names, and that seems a bit... wrong.

Hint: also trying to start new topic!!

[enwiabe]

To enwiabe,

How is this so called bitching offensive though? I haven't criticised anyone's ENTER except my own.

I'm not sure if I agree that people could have worked more than me for a lower ENTER. Not sure if nature permits this to happen. You can't possibly have worked more than me and got a lower ENTER score.

Is that really true, that some schools don't have laboratory equipment - in Australia? I somehow thought all schools had roughly the same facilities.

I don't know why you think it's silly though, it's only ambition.

This post encapsulated just how seemingly unwilling you are to empathise with others. Yes, people did work harder than you. They scored lower. That's a reality. As hard as you worked, there was somebody working harder. And they achieved less than you.

And you need to open your eyes and look at schools with median study scores of 20. They absolutely do not have the same facilities as you. Nowhere near, in fact. I guess it's the "living in a bubble" effect :-/

It is silly, you're going to realise it now that you're out in the real world. Not today, or tomorrow, but I would say within the next year, you're going to have an "OSHI-" moment, and it will all become clear.

[IntoTheNewWorld]

To enwiabe,

How is this so called bitching offensive though? I haven't criticised anyone's ENTER except my own.

I'm not sure if I agree that people could have worked more than me for a lower ENTER. Not sure if nature permits this to happen. You can't possibly have worked more than me and got a lower ENTER score.

Is that really true, that some schools don't have laboratory equipment - in Australia? I somehow thought all schools had roughly the same facilities.

I don't know why you think it's silly though, it's only ambition.

This post encapsulated just how seemingly unwilling you are to empathise with others. Yes, people did work harder than you. They scored lower. That's a reality. As hard as you worked, there was somebody working harder. And they achieved less than you.

And you need to open your eyes and look at schools with median study scores of 20. They absolutely do not have the same facilities as you. Nowhere near, in fact. I guess it's the "living in a bubble" effect :-/

It is silly, you're going to realise it now that you're out in the real world. Not today, or tomorrow, but I would say within the next year, you're going to have an "OSHI-" moment, and it will all become clear.

I agree with this post oh so much.

I find it incredible that ILMM seems to be wholly unaware of how she sounds, with a complete lack of tact, humility, and perspective. "living in a bubble" effect indeed.

[Ilovemathsmeth]

I don't understand why English is scaled down in fact I don't understand why English is scaled down at all. If its [the only] compulsory subject why not just leave it as the raw study score? I think the scaling down is a bigger disadvantage to students than the actual subject being in the top four itself.

Hint: I'm trying to start a new topic of conversation.

Yep agree. Why should it be scaled down?

[periwinkle]

 ILMM: There is nothing wrong with your arguments per se, however the fact that you use them to promote your own case makes you seem petty and supercilious.
  You seem a very nice person in the context of all your posts, however. Why soil your reputation in
one thread?

[Ilovemathsmeth]

ILMM: There is nothing wrong with your arguments per se, however the fact that you use them to promote your own case makes you seem petty and supercilious.
  You seem a very nice person in the context of all your posts, however. Why soil your reputation in
one thread?

I dunno, I was trying to back up my arguments with real evidence.

[NE2000]

I imply that that's the extent to which I've worked. That you couldn't have worked a lot more than what I did. Nature would be wrong to give you a lower ENTER.

I've always got this impression from you: that somehow you consider yourself the epitome of hard work. Do you know how incredibly self-centered that is? Is this sense of entitlement your idea of humility?

You know what, I know some perfectionists and I know some people who worked incredibly hard in VCE both to get higher ENTERs than yours and lower. SmRandmAzn goes to a school which will have its own huge share of perfectionists and people who beat themselves up over anything less than full marks. But so many of them are humble about it and are on a path of self improvement where they feel annoyed with themselves for not getting a high enough score rather than getting annoyed with the system. These are people who if they make a careless error will put it down to not working hard enough to eliminate careless errors from their own work, or for not having the right exam technique. If these people get a 9/10 for an essay they will put it down to not planning it properly, or being unclear in their contention, not because English is a pointless subject. And none of them seem to think that how much they've worked is enough...in fact in the nature of a perfectionist is this notion that if you had worked harder or kept your presence of mind you could have got a higher score.

Perfectionism is about self improvement.

edit: yeah I'm a perfectionist too, and proud of it...