English Advanced Question Thread

[elysepopplewell]

Hey guys! how can I make this 3rd person. I have been trying to do it, but it doesn't end up making sense. ". Drinking enough to forget your name . Peoples chants were enough to mask the burning sensation as the liquid slides down your throat. Slurring the destination to the taxi driver then giving them a hug before getting out. At least that's what Sarah pictured when she was 13."

Hey Sarah! Welcome to the ATAR Notes forums

She was drinking enough to forget his name . People's chants were enough to mask the burning sensation as the liquid slides down her throat. Slurring the destination to the taxi driver, she gave them a big hug before getting out. At least that's what Sarah pictured when she was 13.

How does this sound?

[f_tan]

Hey! Just wondering - how would if anyone has any suggestions to approaching a question like this? What would you base each of your paragraphs on? Would you just choose a belief/perception that is challenged in the text and base each paragraph on a different belief/perception? Thanks! 

The process of discovery results in individuals challenging their beliefs and perspectives.
To what extent is the above statement true in your prescribed text and ONE related text?

[elysepopplewell]

Hey! Just wondering - how would if anyone has any suggestions to approaching a question like this? What would you base each of your paragraphs on? Would you just choose a belief/perception that is challenged in the text and base each paragraph on a different belief/perception? Thanks! 

The process of discovery results in individuals challenging their beliefs and perspectives.
To what extent is the above statement true in your prescribed text and ONE related text?

As always, there are many ways to go about this. I think one way is to focus on the different beliefs and perspectives, but this might limit your linking cohesively between the two texts. Another idea is to kind of look at it all in sequential order:
Para one: How one comes to have beliefs (what shapes these)
Para two: What challenges beliefs? What are the obstacles to this?
Para three: how does such a discovery about perspectives change one's relationships with others?

My favourite approach is to take this sequential order attack. Alternatively, you could talk about the different types of perspectives: one's held for a long time, new perspectives, and when perspectives clash.

What speaks to you?

[f_tan]

As always, there are many ways to go about this. I think one way is to focus on the different beliefs and perspectives, but this might limit your linking cohesively between the two texts. Another idea is to kind of look at it all in sequential order:
Para one: How one comes to have beliefs (what shapes these)
Para two: What challenges beliefs? What are the obstacles to this?
Para three: how does such a discovery about perspectives change one's relationships with others?

My favourite approach is to take this sequential order attack. Alternatively, you could talk about the different types of perspectives: one's held for a long time, new perspectives, and when perspectives clash.

What speaks to you?

Thanks so much! I like the structure you suggested.
Just one more question - how many paragraphs do you suggest writing, and would it be better to alternate between the two texts or combine the two texts together in each para?

[elysepopplewell]

Thanks so much! I like the structure you suggested.
Just one more question - how many paragraphs do you suggest writing, and would it be better to alternate between the two texts or combine the two texts together in each para?

Ahh, the age old question. It's tricky, because there are so many paragraph types. I think the best way to begin writing your first AOS essay is to alternate between the two texts, one paragraph at a time. Then, once you know your argument and the evidence you think works best, you can move towards integration. There's a debate about integrated paragraphs and what it actually means. Essentially, I believe that if you aren't integrating at all, your essay won't be very cohesive. If you integrate in the form of two texts in one paragraph then you are forcing yourself to deal with the two in a way that prompts comparison, which is great. But, you could also link with ideas and common threads, but in different paragraphs. I did this kind of approach, I suggest you have a look at my essay here so that you can see what I'm talking about. Basically, the two texts were in different paragraphs but they were linked nonetheless. My Extension English essay was completely integrated. What I'm saying is that there are so many ways to build your paragraphs, and you've just got to find what works for you and your texts.

So, typically, either 3 or 6 paragraphs will take up an essay, depending if you are being textually integrated or keeping them separate. The discovery essay is a process, unfortunately, so it will take some trial and error

[bholenath125]

We have to do a speech for AOS on tempest and a related. I have chosen my related to be Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde
and this is a potential thesis that i have

 In both texts, the protagonists have discovered and exercised the power that can come from prioritising strength and malice over compassion. Each protagonist comes to realise the horrifying and destructive nature of such power, but the outcomes diverge: Prospero’s moral epiphany leads him to relinquish his powers and manipulations, whereas Jekyll is unable to reverse his transformation and cannot achieve redemption.



Also for Tempest I'm going to use Prospero's abuse of power as his pre-discovery phase
and for his discovery I'm going to explore how he chooses virtue over vengeance which is his renewed perception

I aim to link this to strange case of dr. jekyll and mr. hyde
exploring the power that comes with dehumanisation, and how discovering that this is horrifying but (unlike Prospero) being unable to reverse it.


..Prospero’s discovery arose from an interpersonal relationship that enabled him to reform his perception of what had become familiar. Jekyll, by contrast, was too isolated to experience his own epiphany at a time when redemption would still have been possible, meaning that his realisation comes too late and he is effectively irredeemable.

but once again I'm having a little bit of trouble establishing clearer links and finding analyses for strange case that is in depth. Could you recommend some good resources that I could use.



Thanks

[elysepopplewell]

We have to do a speech for AOS on tempest and a related. I have chosen my related to be Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde
and this is a potential thesis that i have

 In both texts, the protagonists have discovered and exercised the power that can come from prioritising strength and malice over compassion. Each protagonist comes to realise the horrifying and destructive nature of such power, but the outcomes diverge: Prospero’s moral epiphany leads him to relinquish his powers and manipulations, whereas Jekyll is unable to reverse his transformation and cannot achieve redemption.



Also for Tempest I'm going to use Prospero's abuse of power as his pre-discovery phase
and for his discovery I'm going to explore how he chooses virtue over vengeance which is his renewed perception

I aim to link this to strange case of dr. jekyll and mr. hyde
exploring the power that comes with dehumanisation, and how discovering that this is horrifying but (unlike Prospero) being unable to reverse it.


..Prospero’s discovery arose from an interpersonal relationship that enabled him to reform his perception of what had become familiar. Jekyll, by contrast, was too isolated to experience his own epiphany at a time when redemption would still have been possible, meaning that his realisation comes too late and he is effectively irredeemable.

but once again I'm having a little bit of trouble establishing clearer links and finding analyses for strange case that is in depth. Could you recommend some good resources that I could use.
Thanks

I think this is a reasonably in depth view of the text. Duality is interesting. This resource is also quite in depth. I find that if you type "academia" or "University" at the end of your google search, you'll find more in depth readings. This is how I've located the readings for this and your question on the Extension board.

I haven't studied both of your texts, so unfortunately my help is limited in terms of helping you link the two. I can suggest that you find similarities in discovery, rather than in plot. It could be as simple as: both texts begin with pre-conceived notions of what equality is. Simple. The plots could be wildly different, but that stage of discovery is the same, that's the link.

With your thesis statement, I think it is always best to have at least one sentence to start off your essay that does not mention the texts at all: it purely talks about discovery. This is because AOS is a concept-based study, not a text-based study like the other modules. So you need to raise a point about discovery in isolation, and then continue to support it throughout your response. Here's a guide I wrote in the hopes of helping with the creation of a thesis statement, have a read and let me know what you think

[katnisschung]

Hi anyone willing to help..

I have an essay question (for a speech)
"Discoveries can affirm or challenge our assumptions and beliefs about the world." Analyse the impact
of this statement in relation to two of your chosen texts

I have completely rejigged my thesis (my previous one was a complete repetition of the essay question...."The affirmation of challenge of beliefs is dependent on the perspective attained by an individual's discovery--> Jamon did approve this but probably out of pity lmao)

An individual’s willingness towards discovery shapes the extent of their renewed perceptions which have the capacity to affirm or challenge assumptions and beliefs.

for my texts i am doing dead poet's society (film) and the adventures of huckleberry finn (novel)
i was thinking for my points i could do it by character (to show how their level of willingness affects the capacity to make new discoveries)

AHF

Huck (morality) challenged
Huck is willing to undergo a discovery of this nature due to his status as child (views are malleable)
allows him to undergo a discovery regarding his
preconceived beliefs of race to be challenged (realises the insidous nature of society)

Jim (race) challenged

willing to make a discovery because he has been stereotyped he does not want
to inflict that upon others judge others by their race.
his negative views of White Americans are challenged
DPS
Todd (conformity) challenged

willing to discover because he felt oppressed by his preconceived belief by his
need to conform, he sought an escape leading to new perceptions
challenged his views of conformity, challenges over the need for individuality

Richard Cameron
unwilling to make discovery therefore assumptions affirmed
preconceived belief that conformity is more important than pretty much anything else in the world
discovers what problems could be caused by not conforming and breaking away
from traditional ideals


is this too left of centre becos i feel like my previous thesis didn't really provide an opinion
really just reinstated the essay statement

any help would be great...haha last minute as always

[jamonwindeyer]

Hi anyone willing to help..
...
any help would be great...haha last minute as always

Hey Katniss! So on your Thesis:

An individual’s willingness towards discovery shapes the extent of their renewed perceptions which have the capacity to affirm or challenge their assumptions and beliefs.

- The bit in red doesn't quite sit right, a little expression fix is needed
- I'd also add 'their' where indicated
- Besides that, this seems like a good Thesis!

I think your paragraphs work, but I do think the first few sound quite similar; all willing to discover, just some small differences. It may be worth thinking a bit more about how you split the paragraphs up, because even if it is for different characters, you do need some reason for having each paragraph. You can't repeat yourself completely remember the focus does need to stay on beliefs being challenged/affirmed too! Don't put all your energy into willingness without linking that to challenges/affirmations!

[katnisschung]

Hey Katniss! So on your Thesis:

An individual’s willingness towards discovery shapes the extent of their renewed perceptions which have the capacity to affirm or challenge their assumptions and beliefs.

- The bit in red doesn't quite sit right, a little expression fix is needed
- I'd also add 'their' where indicated
- Besides that, this seems like a good Thesis!

I think your paragraphs work, but I do think the first few sound quite similar; all willing to discover, just some small differences. It may be worth thinking a bit more about how you split the paragraphs up, because even if it is for different characters, you do need some reason for having each paragraph. You can't repeat yourself completely remember the focus does need to stay on beliefs being challenged/affirmed too! Don't put all your energy into willingness without linking that to challenges/affirmations!

Thanks Jamon!

yeah i'm trying not to go off on a tangent about the individual's will becos
well the questions ask for affirmations and challenge of beliefs

i don't think i was very clear in my previous post but i was trying to use my
thesis i guess as a backbone as to why their discoveries lead to affirmation/ defiance
of their preconceived beliefs then have the rest of the paragraph about how
their discovery affirm/challenges their beliefs...

[jamonwindeyer]

Thanks Jamon!

yeah i'm trying not to go off on a tangent about the individual's will becos
well the questions ask for affirmations and challenge of beliefs

i don't think i was very clear in my previous post but i was trying to use my
thesis i guess as a backbone as to why their discoveries lead to affirmation/ defiance
of their preconceived beliefs then have the rest of the paragraph about how
their discovery affirm/challenges their beliefs...

Yeah that definitely works in that case!! if you frame it that way it works, and definitely is a little more sophisticated than your previous iteration

[anotherworld2b]

Hi I'm back with quite a few questions.
In my responses I always tend to incorporate a quote into a sentence by describing the technique used in 'quote'.
I was wondering if there are other ways to effectively 'quote' a quote
I also took into consideration Jamon's advice to ensure all my analysis goes to TEA - Technique, Example and Audience Impact.
I also took into consideration Elyse's tips on aspects that construct voice but I'm kind of confused about the effect of the technique of high/low modality on audience impact. I also wanted to ask what kind of audience impact can tone have? I 'm still a bit new to the concept of how tone can influence the audience's response
I was also wondering what would be the best way to explain the audience impact of the technique of first person point of point being more personal articulately? If first person is considered more personal could I say that third person point of view is in a sense omitted/detached?

I really appreciate all advice and feedback received. It is greatly appreciated 

[elysepopplewell]

Hi I'm back with quite a few questions.
In my responses I always tend to incorporate a quote into a sentence by describing the technique used in 'quote'.
I was wondering if there are other ways to effectively 'quote' a quote
I also took into consideration Jamon's advice to ensure all my analysis goes to TEA - Technique, Example and Audience Impact.
I also took into consideration Elyse's tips on aspects that construct voice but I'm kind of confused about the effect of the technique of high/low modality on audience impact. I also wanted to ask what kind of audience impact can tone have? I 'm still a bit new to the concept of how tone can influence the audience's response
I was also wondering what would be the best way to explain the audience impact of the technique of first person point of point being more personal articulately? If first person is considered more personal could I say that third person point of view is in a sense omitted/detached?

I really appreciate all advice and feedback received. It is greatly appreciated 

Rather than saying "quote" which can sound quite disjointed at times, the best option is to embed it. So, "The simile used by Smith to personify the brush, "*enter quote here*"... Or, make the quote as small as possible, instead of using an entire sentence, just take the exact bit you need and slice it into a sentence.
If you can't embed the quote, because it's too long or too awkward, then try synonyms for "quote" like excerpt.

High and low modality are very important in speeches. High modality is usually most persuasive in a confident, demanding way. "We must bring our children to the highest quality education" incites a lot of emotion and power. So the audience is likely to feel encouraged to act in that way. Low modality is often unsure, although it can be inviting in a passive way. Usually, you'll find that masculine personas speak in high modality and feminine personas use low modality. It's about expressing a nature.

As for tone, it's a little more tricky because it's just broader. The tone that someone talks in usually isn't able to be pin pointed to one sentence, but rather a collection of sentences that give off a "vibe." Tone is important, nonetheless. If someone is using high modality, but they are speaking in a condescending tone, they incite a different response to the person who used high modality in an optimistic tone. Tone doesn't work the best on its own, it compliments other aspects of the text. Tone is most clearly expressed through word choice and syntax!

First and third person personas can do both of what you said above, but it doesn't have to be that way. First person personas can be intimate, although not always. Sometimes they are still quite detached in what they reveal. A first person narrator isn't always an open book, they can still be quite reserved. Third person persona isn't always detached, although it can be. It can also be voyeuristic, or omniscient.

Let me know if you want to flesh out any more of these ideas. It seems like you're really working hard on this assessment!

[Yasminpotts1105]

Should a standard essay be about 1500 words or more?
Is there a best acronym for writing paragraphs? I've heard so many that it is just starting to leave me very confused.

Mod Edit: Merged two posts.

[elysepopplewell]

Should a standard essay be about 1500 words or more?
Is there a best acronym for writing paragraphs? I've heard so many that it is just starting to leave me very confused.

Mod Edit: Merged two posts.

A standard essay could be about 1500 words, but I definitely wouldn't push it any more than that, it would be quite an accomplishment to get to that length! Typically, I think that 800-1200 is a great length for an essay.
As for acronyms, I really don't think one is best. They are all very similar, yet often slightly different to suit your own writing style. A misconception is that this will suit your paragraph on its own: TEEL (Technique, evidence, explain, link). What people mean when they suggest this is something more like: Thesis, technique,  evidence, explain, link, technique, evidence, explain, link, technique, evidence explain, link, closing statement. So in a paragraph, you'd need to repeat the acronym a few times.

As you become more comfortable, you can adjust the structure. You might do the evidence before the technique in one instance, or the linking and the explaining at the same time. I think that the acronym is a great place to start for an essay, and once you have the foundations of it all you need to start twisting and turning the acronyms to suit your essay. So to answer, I think TEEL is probably one of the best acronyms, although they are quite similar. I know some people take the L off and combine the Explain and the Link together, which I think works just as well (even better, perhaps).